Thread: 5.1 Crafting Feedback Thread

Originally Posted by Frizze

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and i dont think anyone here is convincing anyone else to change their point of view. With that said, i have to object to the "10x more work" part of your statement. Using just custom deliveries, facet hand ins, and doing GC turn ins only on easy days i leveled up all 11 crafting and gathering classes from 70 to 80 during the first month of 5.0's release. Looking back to stormblood it was just custom deliveries, class quests, and the easy days worth of GC hand ins and i similarly had 11 classes from 60-70 in 3-4 weeks. I started post HW, and getting each non-fishing class from 1-60 took about 2 weeks(still using an easy mode of ixali dailies, class quests, gc turn ins, and the occasional leve - i had them all done before moogles became a thing). Fishing took me most of 2 years, but i haaaaaaate fishing. None of that is hard or even super time consuming. Certainly not 10x anything.

But yet, if you don't mind putting in a couple hours per day, you could have a DoW/DoM class levelled from 70 to 80 in about 2-3 days, not counting the daily roulettes, even before Pixies. Or you could just binge for a few classes and get one class 70->80 in a single day if you wanted. It takes about 20 minutes per dungeon run, and each dungeon run yields roughly 50% of a level (for the first level a dungeon is available, about 30% for the 2nd) if you run the current dungeon with the occasional need to do one extra run. So an average of 50 minutes per levelup, maybe an hour max, is 10 hours per class. That's *NOT* counting Leveling Roulette. Now obviously the average person can't do this every day, as most of us have jobs, but if you did this twice a week if you really wanted to put your nose to the grindstone and then the other 5 days in a week you simply do the roulettes (only 1 hour) and nothing else, well...

One week = 2 job levelled from the dungeon run binges, 1 job halfway levelled just from the roulettes. This is assuming you are NOT doing the MSQ Roulette, and if you don't mind spending an extra hour per day, well you could have that 3rd job completely levelled and then some, so that'd actually be 3+ jobs per week.

It would take you about 3.5 weeks to get these jobs levelled (or sooner if you did MSQ roulette). Which is about the same as the 11 DoH/DoL classes, but... you don't have to buy anything, nor do you have to go out and farm skins/etc or do FATEs for the gemstones to buy such. You get all of your gear from the dungeon runs themselves, and you actually make money rather than spending it (Roulette gil does add up over time, as well as selling materia from clusters).

I kinda doubt that you were able to get all 11 DoH/DoL classes up without buying much of anything, because of just how many mob drops are needed for some of those recipes, and Prior to 5.1, the rate of XP gain was far, far slower. That, and we are assuming here, that you are starting out with decked out gear from the previous expansion.

If you didn't start out with such gear, you'd have to sink 2 million+ into a starter set of equipment or grind up scrips to buy the previous expansions' gear before you could even start, because you're not going to HQ anything with NQs until you grind out a level first, at the very least (and even then you're still looking at upwards of a million to buy a whole set of clothes and tools from the NPC).

So if you're a player who came from the previous expansion with just enough to do Namazu quests, you were looking at quite the shopping spree before you could even begin. But, if you're doing DoW or DoM, you had previous dungeon gear already on you unless you threw it away, and doing those roulettes would quickly give you the Tomestones to buy gear, esp. if you did MSQ. MSQ+Trials is 500+ tomes per day; you'd likely have enough tomes to deck out all the tank and healer jobs in the first week and start on the DPS jobs and have them done in the other two weeks (+ what you'd find dropping in Holminster Switch).

And under 5.0, you couldn't just level *one* crafter to 80, oh no, you needed *all* the crafters because of the cross-class skills and the fact that nearly everything you make requires items made from several different crafts, lumber, goldsmith nuggets, bsm ingots, alchemy tinctures/glue, weaver cloth, etc.

Originally Posted by KageTokage

The only thing I dislike about crafting/gathering being more accessible is that there's been a noticeable increase in the amount of new bot farmers as a side-effect, at least on my side of things.

You'd think there'd be less of them with the process being made less tedious.

One would think. But bot farmers think and that in itself is a problem.

@Maeka - this is not specifically targeted at you, you were just the last using this argument of 'crafters overcharged = they are unjustly rich because of it'.

I'm tired of being hit around the head with this argument in every thread where crafters are asking for more complex / harder crafting. And yes, harder crafting will make items more expensive but potentially also more time consuming.

Someone - like me - that started back in 1.0 - 100 million might be a lot, for a newer player 1 million might be a lot.

I've sold multiple 1000's of crafted items over the years and hit 10 million shortly before 5.0. I tend to charge at the lower end of the price scale.
I've also spent maybe 10 million on levelling up desynth.


Gathering example
Collect 400 resources and sell them = 30mins / 120 - 200k
Collect 400 resources & transform into 100 nq resources = 40mins / 100 - 200k
Collect 400 resources & transform into 100 hq resources = 75 mins / 300 - 500k

Adventure example (dailies)
- 2 retainer = 5k
- 5 dailies = 70 - 80k
- 12 beast tribe adventures = 30k
- Daily hunts = 30k
= Total 100 - 150k

Treasure hunts / fate farming = much more especially if you sell dropped resources.

Gear prices
Pre 5.0. top 'white' HQ gear, which was always sufficient if threshold was met up to 1-2 * items with no overmelds.
After 5.0, this works with full 80 HQ non facet gear and no overmelding (80% hq without any prerequisites hq)

Prices pre 4.0: top white HQ Crafter (80) / Gatherer gear : 100 - 250k
Prices 5:0: top white HQ Crafter / Gatherer gear: 40 -120k with majority around 60-90k, (90%), some few exceptions: 150-240k, Facet gear to start: 250 - 750k (not needed to create facet gear)
Prices after 5.1: 60's - 70's white hq gear: 10-90k, top white HQ Crafter (80) / Gatherer gear: 8k - 25k for vast majority, few exceptions 40-80k, facet gear : 100 - 150k (full set 1.2 - 1.5 million)

I personally don't consider these prices to be outrageous at all, on the contrary i would argue they are now too low to be worth making for the vast majority of items.

MSQ
If you do full MSQ and selling drops you don't need, you should be nearing 5 million without doing much else.

Conclusion
So please folks, stop this myth of every crafter is so rich because they overcharged.
This is just not the truth and either was achieved by extreme time investment, playing the MB and/or crafting stuff which requires rare drops and / or unspoiled resources.

PS. I'm someone who does large-scale HW leves for completion purposes, so definately not the most efficient money maker out there.