Why use a Dragoon or Monk when you can use a Warrior?

[Aion]

There is not a warrior alive who can out dps my dragoon, against any number of enemies. There is not a warrior alive that can out dps a monk on a single target. My linkshell doesn't use warrior in any situation apart from tanking. Warriors replacing other classes? LOLurdoinitwrong.

since you good using DRG, I wanna ask some questions:
1. what is paralysis do?
2. What kind of damage can be reduced by dreadspike, is it all kind of damage?
3. I found vorpal thrust usually miss, is it by nature of LNC post 1.21?

[Alerith]

The same reason people still choose to play Paladin over Warrior for tanking, even though we clearly see the shortcomings. Because we like Paladin.

[FraenirVolsung]

I think there is a lot of truth to both sides of this debate. WAR is probably the most utilitarian job right now. The fact that it can take on two roles in a party makes it more beneficial than other jobs. WAR may not out DD a good MNK or a good DRG, but the difference is not huge. WAR can tank better than a MNK and DRG just doesn't have the necessary abilities to tank in any realistic capacity. WAR tanks better than the actual designed tank job, PLD. It's not a surprise that parties learning new raids, pick-up groups, or those who simply want the fastest, easiest, simplest combination of jobs would want WARs before MNK or DRGs.

That being said, it is completely possible to complete the new content with any combination of jobs that meet the basic needs of a party. It's finding people who are willing to run the new content with that combination that is the challenge for most players. Even in fairly close knit LS's, you still hear people's job preferences being pushed aside for jobs that make things easier or more efficient. Chances are unless you play with a set group of close friends, you are probably going to be asked to play a job that isn't your preference unless your job of preference is currently WAR, WHM, BLM, or BRD. Not saying that's right, but it's the reality. It's the player base who has created that mentality with the help of SE's pitiful ability to create balanced content.

To me, that's where the problem lies. SE should be creating content that requires the use of multiple jobs to complete. In my opinion, you should never be able to throw a tank, a healer, and 6 BLMS at something and it becomes 500% easier than it would be with a balanced party. Maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to remember Yoshi-P stating that he felt that party roles fell into 4 categories and those categories are what should comprise a party...a tank, a healer, a DD, and a buffer. If content were balanced, you should be able to run content with a tank, a healer, a DD, a buffer and 4 other party members of mixed abilities. Instead we've seen a tank, a healer, a buffer and 5 BLMs, or a tank, a healer, a buffer and 5 LNCs, or substitute 5 LNCs with 5 ARCs.

I'm not saying content should be easier, but surely there's a way to balance it so that each and every job can offer something to any content whether it be raids or primals. Surely, there's a way to balance things so that PLD, WHM, BLM, BRD, MNK, DRG, WAR, WHM works just as efficiently as WAR, WAR, WHM, WHM, BRD, BLM, BLM, BLM.

[TirionCrey]

Warriors have plenty of AoE, AoE stun, and who cares if they get hate because they can unquestionably tank. Where is Dragoons niche? The ability to run away?

I fail to see these so called "plenty AoEs"...

@OP: Well, WAR stacking might be viable but only if you're WHMs such so bad, they can't keep meeles alive and/or Meeles that are not WAR are too slow to get away from trouble, so they rely on WARs HP pool to survive anything...

Both shows a lack in skill, while the game definetely supports using MNK and DRG, since both do better and faster DPS then WAR, the only thing is, they are squishy...that's it.

More reasons...WAR needs to start his Steel Cyclone Combo in front of the target, Steel Cyclone Stun is very "occasional", while Leg Sweep Stun is pretty much always happening with few exceptions.

DRG has access to his AoE WSs faster and more often then WAR.

MNK just straight outdmgs anything in the game right now without exception. Collusion a MNK right before Blindside Dragon Kick, and all others who are yellow/red in that moment will jump to green/yellow.

Overall I don't see any reason to take more then 1 WAR(for tanking), since all other DPS classes do a better job.

Sure as WAR you survive, but surviving shit shouldn't be a viable factor into what DD class to play, DPS should be the biggest factor, especially with survival being accomplished by something as stupid as having skill.

[Tyro]

since you good using DRG, I wanna ask some questions:
1. what is paralysis do?
2. What kind of damage can be reduced by dreadspike, is it all kind of damage?
3. I found vorpal thrust usually miss, is it by nature of LNC post 1.21?

1. Can interrupt spellcasting and actions that need to be readied (when you see the enemy charging)
2. Dreadspike sucks.
3. Vorpal Thrust has no accuracy issues, Impulse Drive does. We get to use Feint > Disembowel instead when that happens.

[Firon]

The same reason people still choose to play Paladin over Warrior for tanking, even though we clearly see the shortcomings. Because we like Paladin.

Me personally i still prefer Pld cause with a Pld you don't need 2 Whm's spamming cure's on the tank cause pld has holy succor. So that in turn leaves the other Whm to spam cura/curaga on melee

[Meleena]

Why use a Dragoon or Monk when you can use a Warrior?

I remember a time in the game where Marauder could destroy 20 monsters by going:
- Brutal Swing > Storm's Path > Storms path > Heavy Swing > Storms Path > Storms Path.

We all know what happened to this anyway, so you all know what's coming :P

[Alerith]

As a career PLD, let me say that WAR does not deserve, nor would I like to see it, get nerfed. There is nothing wrong with WAR at this time.

PLD needs boosts in a variety of places to bring it up to an acceptable level.

[Keith_Dragoon]

Dragoons attack faster, have a damn near spammable aoe stun that chains to our heavy hitting TP Move (Heavy Thrust > Leg Sweep > Doomspike), Dragoons also can attack from a further distance outside of most close burst aoes like Ifrit's seer and such. Ontop of that whenever a Dragoon misses he gets to fire off a combo that can paralyze most targets while dealing good damage.

Monk put out insane ammounts of single target damage if played right and can drop some good debuffs with their combos. can virtually spam TP moves with fists of wind up and their TP gain. They make great support and heavy DD.

Warrior is only good for its hate building dmg and slef heals from crits but that would just cause chaosin the party with spotty hate jumping from one to another unless they hold back which defeats the purpose of being a DD if you have o restrict yourself from dealing damage because you pull insane ammounts of hate.

I think they all have their place in a party setup of every type and it should remain that way. I am constantly being forced to go DRG to LS events even though I'd prefer to go BRD or WHM because of my ability to throw out consistant dmg and not go beyond yellow hate after a few combos.

[HokSeven]

To me, that's where the problem lies. SE should be creating content that requires the use of multiple jobs to complete. In my opinion, you should never be able to throw a tank, a healer, and 6 BLMS at something and it becomes 500% easier than it would be with a balanced party. Maybe I'm wrong, but I seem to remember Yoshi-P stating that he felt that party roles fell into 4 categories and those categories are what should comprise a party...a tank, a healer, a DD, and a buffer. If content were balanced, you should be able to run content with a tank, a healer, a DD, a buffer and 4 other party members of mixed abilities. Instead we've seen a tank, a healer, a buffer and 5 BLMs, or a tank, a healer, a buffer and 5 LNCs, or substitute 5 LNCs with 5 ARCs.

I'm not saying content should be easier, but surely there's a way to balance it so that each and every job can offer something to any content whether it be raids or primals. Surely, there's a way to balance things so that PLD, WHM, BLM, BRD, MNK, DRG, WAR, WHM works just as efficiently as WAR, WAR, WHM, WHM, BRD, BLM, BLM, BLM.

This. I always wander why SE does not learn from their mistakes. Really? you can't force people to bring other jobs into the mix? I don't like the word "force", but it's better than having 5 ARC or 5 BLMs everytime. Yes, there are people who try things out and do well on those. But mostly they are LS friends. Go to a pick up party and tell them I'll do ifrit as PGL. Wait for the laughs or no response....

So, again to my question. SE wants to "force" people to drag melee into fight? Two ways... Go the easy route of enemy building resistance to magic or range. Meaning the more mages or range the worse. This also means the more melee the worse.

The other idea, make them situational. How does that works, with say ifrit? easy, make the spikes un-damageble by magic or range.... EASY. Then everyone will have to drag at least one melee. Moogle? Same, make some moogles immune to magic or range... is it really that hard to implement and make fights more fun? I'm sure they can think of more ways, I did while writing this....