Highly Notorious Monsters

[Blackpearlguy]

just make ALL NM's like FATE then everyone can help kill it get tokens if you win then you good to go. group claim gameplay is is old now the groups will just have the rest of the LS healing from the out side is pointless might as well make it a big event when the NM pops. if you get a general thing like the tokens you wont have problems getting stuff done because it will always be worth while to help someone.
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Other MMO's have tried this (namely Guild Wars 2) and nobody finds it very interesting/fun. If you try it you see its more of a mob scenario rather than ANY strategy involved. I liked the conversation about Dark Ixion and SW, those were really interesting ways to spawn/camp an HNM. I think we're all starting to think the camping part isn't fun- for some of us it is! If the NM wasn't cornered into a small spot on a map it could be really cool to have your LS running around on the hunt.

The other thing is if we had two options one which would be the old-school 21-24 hr camping method, the other a spawned pop like hakutaku/zipacna which you could do once a week. I think this solves both parties problems, and you can get the best of both worlds if you like!

[Ramesses]

I think what indira was trying to explain was that it could help make drops more evenly distributed; while also giving people a fair chance at gathering "tokens" to be used towards a piece of gear or weapon they really want.

Honestly, right now I love the idea for FATE but perhaps what has people worried is how some high level LS could potentially figure out ways to manipulate the FATE mob (similar to the annoying methods devised for claiming the Magiteks during the Garlean invasion events).

And no, I completely disagree with bringing back the old school 21-24 hour pop style from FFXI... the amount of crap I saw in the game just because of this method actually made me quit the HNMLS scene for a GOOD while. Plus, that will ruin 2.0 on SEVERAL levels.

The O-Hat run method of spawning Hakutaku was always a great idea in my book cuz you farmed or crafted the pieces for the spawn. It had the elements of "your effort, your friends, your drop."

[Blackpearlguy]

I think what indira was trying to explain was that it could help make drops more evenly distributed; while also giving people a fair chance at gathering "tokens" to be used towards a piece of gear or weapon they really want.

Honestly, right now I love the idea for FATE but perhaps what has people worried is how some high level LS could potentially figure out ways to manipulate the FATE mob (similar to the annoying methods devised for claiming the Magiteks during the Garlean invasion events).
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Just throwing this out there, Yoshi-P stated that FATE mobs will NOT be claimable. That means you could have, for instance, 90 people fighting fafnir. This leads to 0 skill being demonstrated just button mashing, death, respawn close and run back, you never even need a tank. Yes you get your own loot pool but at the expense of any strategy or skill needed. Additionally if it were a FATE mob you wouldn't need a linkshell, just a bunch of people wanting to button smash. Then you get your item and you're on your merry way.

Half the fun in fighting big mobs is HELPING others get item x, not just you getting item y. Being a bit selfish aren't we?

It seems like the majority of the player base who has experienced HNMs is leaning towards forced pops? The rest want a newer system, but still seem to be shy on force pop HNM. I think it comes down to- do you want to help others get items, or just yourself?

[Alhanelem]

think we're all starting to think the camping part isn't fun- for some of us it is! If the NM wasn't cornered into a small spot on a map it could be really cool to have your LS running around on the hunt.

The few examples of where camping an NM required you to be actively playing the game are the few examples where camping was actually good. But I'm speaking for the bulk of HNMs in XI where all you did was go to his spawn point, go AFK, and check every 30 minutes to see if it pops or not.

For most of the camps, most people did not enjoy the actual camping process. The only exciting moments are 1) the rush that occurs as the NM pops and you scramble to get it and 2) the rush of fighting the NM itself (to me, by far the most important part). You can have these things without stupid nonesense like 30 minute random spawn windows.

Honestly, if you love sitting at a mob's spawn for a few hours waiting for it to pop, I think you should stick to FFXI or another MMO of its era, and let FFXIV try to implement it in a different way that's less about not playing the game and more about actually playing it.

FFXI isn't going away anytime real soon, considering another expansion is on the way. The games are different enough for both to keep running and both to have a distinct player base.

I know some people are going to react that "go play another game" isn't a good argument. But, in case it matters, I'm playing that other game right now. I may even keep both subs running for a while. There are things about both games I like, and sometimes I'll want to play one and sometimes the other.

[Warlock]

Half the fun in fighting big mobs is HELPING others get item x, not just you getting item y. Being a bit selfish aren't we?

Oh the joys of gearing up your asshole leet leader

[schism]

I guess if your LS leader is a dick lol.

Oh the joys of gearing up your asshole leet leader

[Radacci]

I hear whining how boring FF14 is, cause everyone wanna solo!
I hear people say how awesome the community was in XI
I hear people from XI say they dont wanna do HNM together with anyone else. Just their little leet group of people who know how to do tactics. And how boring it is to do things together with the Community. It just turns everything to button mashing.
so i wonder....why do you want HNMs in open world anyways?
Just make everything instanced, so you dont have to meet the rest of the community...

[Blackpearlguy]

I hear whining how boring FF14 is, cause everyone wanna solo!
I hear people say how awesome the community was in XI
I hear people from XI say they dont wanna do HNM together with anyone else. Just their little leet group of people who know how to do tactics. And how boring it is to do things together with the Community. It just turns everything to button mashing.
so i wonder....why do you want HNMs in open world anyways?
Just make everything instanced, so you dont have to meet the rest of the community...

I think you misunderstood what I was saying.. You aren't always going to run around with your linkshell, sometimes you'll want to do other things! This is when FATE will work really great, say that Empire x is attacking empire y and it's up to those who are logged on to help fight these battles across the entire world. Gives that player a little attack/defend/NM fight with random community members while gaining exp. From the FATE event you could form an exp/instance/quest party.

HNM needs to have there own distinctive value (what makes them different and interesting), having to dispatch a number of lesser mobs to get a special item before popping the mega mob seems like a good but old system (Maybe for lesser NMs ie Leaping Lizzy). Interactive camping like Dark Ixion and SW from FFXI would work, because you'd need to skill and coordination just to fight, and then the fight itself would hopefully be extremely hard.

In others defense don't mind me i'm a bias former FFXI player, however I have also played Tera/WoW/GW2/PW/SWtor and saw the glaringly obvious mistakes that have occurred by making everything instanced and so you can run through a world without even interacting with others in it. Excuse the essay, I just think this will be a big part of endgame which will be VERY important to our playerbase and deserves contributions by those of us who have experience in MMOs.

[MikeXiv]

Its simple just implement it for us that want it. For the people who disagree its also very simple do other content, no one is forcing you to do HNMS. Certain gear is supposed to be rare and that's what creates value. Not everyone will be able to obtain the same piece and if your upset with that then i suppose you think everyone at your job (if you have one) should all get the same exact pay

[AresGodofwar]

Now dont kill me for what i'm about to ask, I havnt had time read the whole 91 pages yet but for the 1st page and it's summary.

Did anyone demand for our truly Sky/Sea HNM? I can not say how much great time I had with my LS doing HNM camp while farming Sea and Sky to get some Byakko Pants. I was a hardcore FFXI player and HNM camping and farming was the only purpose i kept playing with my LS for all those great years from 2004-2011.

There is just wanted to stop by and give me support and now let's read all 91 pages.....