Anyone else concerned by the extremely low skill ceiling?

[Liam_Harper]

I'm fine with casual content. I think skill level varies significantly and what a handful on the forums might proclaim is trash tier easy mode, a large majority might struggle to beat even when they try their best and that's fine.

However, I think there needs to be challenging content too, a goal to reach or progress to strive for. It has sort of started a downwards spiral where people put in less and less effort and take content less seriously the more accessible it becomes. It's very hard, they complain, it gets nerfed, they put less effort in, it's still hard, they complain, it gets nerfed, they wipe 3 times on Bone Dragon (3 wipes on an endgame dungeon should be normal), nope waay too hard don't repeat that. Now we have people putting in so little effort they vote abandon on titania normal (literally just tank trees and only half the group needs to know puddles) and complain the NPC controlled battles with 3 buttons are too hard. And it'll only get worse as they keep trying to get those players through content.

Nowadays we expect everything to be accessible. It's bad if we wipe more than once.

I notice too a lot of non-savage players who used to run EX and such are less into it. They're no longer capping phantasma, getting the gear, practicing, prepping for Hades. I don't blame them, because they rolled Titania EX in a week or two and bumbled through Inno blind first run and what's left after that? What do you use that gear for? There's no motivation to master your class either because no one will ever see your performance outside Savage. It depresses me how many EX groups don't realize they're being hard carried by 2-3 individuals and might even flame those individuals for "not healing" a one shot or giving advice.
In WoW as a casual (before they ruined WoW) I had those big 15-20 man Normal raids with guild. They were the big social event, you could take a month progressing, sometimes you'd get stuck on a hard boss for the week. Then you had heroic after and better gear. Then Mythic+ for the in-between that was always a challenge. You always had goals.

As for Savage, some people seem to treat that as a weekly chore for loot. You see it when there's threads discussing adding difficult mechanics. "That'd suck in my weekly pug run, someone who puts in zero effort would drag us down".

I don't mind easier content, but I think there's limits to accessibility. People just start caring less and less the more it's handed over on a plate.

[Videra]

I miss heavensward class design on the whole. Everything was so much better back then.

[TheMightyMollusk]

I miss heavensward class design on the whole. Everything was so much better back then.

Bard is casting "Hello".

[Videra]

Bard is casting "Hello".

3.0 Bard was the best iteration of Bard, you know it to be true.

[Ghald]

I don't do savage raid so I don't know the complexity of having to ballancing all the jobs but what I can say is that many of the jobs are becoming uniformed especially the tank role at least since that's the jobs I'm leveling. So far, PLD/WAR/DRK play more or less the same while GNB feel a little more busy which is good.
I actually fell asleep briefly while grinding for irregular timestone in Praetorium as a SCH, so lucky I wasn't kick off the party, spaming 1 attack button and keep one DoT up was so mind numbingly boring.

[Shinklet]

The people who play this game in general want it to be easy, grind-free, one shottable.

There's a post in this very section asking for hunt immunity for christ's sake. People keep forgetting that MMORPGS used to be one of the most demanding, time consuming, most-research required genres in gaming and not dress up doll simulators.

uwu look at my qute scween shot

[yukiiyuki]

The people who play this game in general want it to be easy, grind-free, one shottable.

There's a post in this very section asking for hunt immunity for christ's sake. People keep forgetting that MMORPGS used to be one of the most demanding, time consuming, most-research required genres in gaming and not dress up doll simulators.

uwu look at my qute scween shot

But at least we got GCBTW, right. Sinking time on MMOs to obtain items, hah, what is this, 2008?

[Kleeya]

So, it means that this time, for the world first ultimate, people are not gonna use things like packets inspection, data mining, automatic call outs of mechanics to come, unauthorized add-ons, etc, to make things way easier than it would normally be ? XD

Irony aside when even the most so-called hardcore players are using all they can to dumb things down, i dont see what's weird when SE end up giving them what they want.

[Adeacia]

So, it means that this time, for the world first ultimate, people are not gonna use things like packets inspection, data mining, automatic call outs of mechanics to come, unauthorized add-ons, etc, to make things way easier than it would normally be ? XD

Irony aside when even the most so-called hardcore players are using all they can to dumb things down, i dont see what's weird when SE end up giving them what they want.

I always find this fact funny. They complain that things aren't hard enough, as they do everything in their power to make it as easy as possible. I have a challenge for them. When any new savage or ultimate comes out, you must clear it with no parser, no voice chat, in first person view with the HUD turned off. Whole party must do this.

Stop trying to make it easy and make it hard.

[Fynlar]

It seems to me that the difference between a poor to average skilled player compared to a skilled player is minuscule performance wise.

Not sure where you get that impression from tbh