Thread: SMN 5.1 Job adjustments

Originally Posted by Karshan

It shouldn't be. in FF a summoner is NOT a pet job, it's a demi calling job, they only did a pet job because they didn't know better at the time (and every mmo needs a pet job to appeal to some public).

The slight problem I have with that statement is due to the fact that despite them "reworking" summoners - which is still @ss in 5.1 - is that some of the quests (especially STARTER arcanist quests) have you send your pet to tank. SE NEVER fixed those quests - EVER. Leveling as an arcanist/summoner is still borked in my opinion. Tried a few fates today at the release of the supposed "fixes" - normal Fates are okay, but it REALLY struggles hard when fighting Boss Fates. Boss Fates that every other class can EASILY kill (SCH included), can still give summoners a bad day. Like I said, if my Red Mage - the one supposedly "weaker" than the BLM and SMN in terms of "damage" - can burn down a Boss Fate FASTER then a Summoner AND survive the fight better than a SMN, then the SMN class is still borked to me. SE really needs to overhaul and redesign the class from the ground up. "It's not a pet job" - then get SE to get rid of the damn egis, apply a gauge to summon Bahamut/Phoenix the same way a MCH gets a gauge to pull off big attacks, etc. egis having piddling damage don't help overall if your rotation still takes abt 2 mins to pull everything off "right" depending on the fight.

I mean yeah, we'll see things differently and that's fine. I like the direction it's going, and I do believe most of our damage still comes from the pets (both Egi and Demi), especially with this new Egi Assault changes. I just like that the summoner themselves also channel the powers of Phoenix and their attacks change, which is what I'd like to see more of in the future. That and the Egi are more involved than ever with the changes.
And I disagree with the lore part, but again...To each their own.

I definitely disagree with this lore comment but will avoid fisticuffs cause I know you pet users love those egis while I hate them lol. Overall these changes seem promising, except pain flare once again being nerfed which I don’t get since we went from kings of aoe to not as good as BLM at aoe.

I do wish we remained above BLM in at least aoe but whatever won’t know till I get to play this new SMN will less weaving thank god!! Thought I would have arthritis from playing this class.

That and SMN was only a pet job in like...FFXI, right? That and FFXI SMN had a bad rep too for how it was designed. Everywhere else it's basically just a (usually more potent) BLM with cutscenes. The new direction FFXIV SMN is going is definitely more inclined to what it is traditionally.

Not even in FFXI was SMN a pet job. You could only keep avatars out for a short time because keeping them out strained your MP, it was basically have them make a move, maybe leave them out for a few seconds then desummon. Only carbuncle could be kept out indefinitely and that was with special rare gloves. Proper pet jobs in FFXI were beastmaster and puppetmaster.

Originally Posted by Namir

Not even in FFXI was SMN a pet job. You could only keep avatars out for a short time because keeping them out strained your MP, it was basically have them make a move, maybe leave them out for a few seconds then desummon. Only carbuncle could be kept out indefinitely and that was with special rare gloves. Proper pet jobs in FFXI were beastmaster and puppetmaster.

You got me remembering that job on FFXI. That brings back memories, but yeah not even close to a pet job, just a support/solo job at best. Interesting job though once you get specific gear to manage your MP(Yinyang robe..Please SE bring that into this game). Made them more useful post WotG or Seekers, but pre-CoP, Fenrir was the ship. That doggie was a must for parties.

Should've, could've, would've.... SMN is what it is.

Originally Posted by Karshan

Yeah that's what a FF SMN is, that's what a lot of people expect and want.

Don't forget that if we're being reductive, RDM Is also just a BLM that weaves multiple elements. Hell, there's not much difference between a Ninja or Samurai at that point. It's mostly style and aesthetics. And yet I don't really see people complaining that any 2 DPS jobs are too similar.

It's not about what you're doing, it's how you're doing it, as well as some super nifty animations while getting there. This is why I personally focus on saying that when I want a redesign of SMN in the next expansion, I want the class focused around trances. Sure, it will be very similar to Black Mage doing that since it would mostly be direct damage shenanigans, but the texture of the trance system is completely different than how a BLM works. Between that and higher mobility, the 2 could even be focused around big numbers but feel completely different.

And that's all that matters when designing classes.

The thing that amaze me with how SE deals with SMN is that the job gets to be turn a complete 180 degree every expansion. From 3.X to 4.X to 5.X, job have never stay exactly the same. While I think it keeps the job being somewhat more exciting to play, I have also always hated the new iteration at the very beginning every time because of how bad it turned out to be and requires more fine tuning patch after patch.