Have we given up on SCH?

[Hatstand]

I haven't seen any threads about SCH issues in a while, only AST (and it's great that AST is being discussed). Have people come to accept the new normal? Are you just too tired to be upset anymore? Have you come to appreciate the changes after all? Are people accepting that AST needs changes more and putting the spotlight on them?

I still have issues with the SCH changes. Where are other people on SCH?

[Kanitezz]

Am I qualified to give my opinion if I don't do savage content? If so... I've always tried to adapt to the changes the devs have made to the jobs I play before being all "This sucks" about them. That being said... I still think SCH is playable but... I REALLY miss Bane. Personally I would've loved Bane back over Energy Drain. I'm also unhappy with Seraph. She really needs potency buffs in my opinion. She's cool to look at, but she's really weak for what she's supposed to be and represent in the SCH toolkit..................... In my opinion..... Also aetherflow outside of combat would be appreciated.

Just a casual's thoughts.

[Hatstand]

Am I qualified to give my opinion if I don't do savage content?

Yes. Everyone who plays or has played SCH to a reasonable degree is qualified to give their opinion. Raids, while important, are only one part of the game. We use our jobs in (just about) all parts of the game.

[Billythepancake]

I still try to bring it up where I can, but it's getting disheartening not hearing anything from the devs. "SCH is strong, so it's fine, it's balanced" etc. Completely ignoring all the issues we have with it.

._. I really wish the devs would say ANYTHING. What healers really need is a voice that isn't momo. Momo, as amazing at the game as he is, only cares about optimizing, everything else is second bananas, so long as SCH can optimize and do it well, then it will be fine in his eyes, and it'll be fine in the eyes of the people who follow him, so there needs to be a voice that opposes his that says "no, SCH and the other healers AREN'T fine", but gl to anyone who attempts to get the following, heh.

[Hatstand]

._. I really wish the devs would say ANYTHING. What healers really need is a voice that isn't momo. Momo, as amazing at the game as he is, only cares about optimizing, everything else is second bananas, so long as SCH can optimize and do it well, then it will be fine in his eyes, and it'll be fine in the eyes of the people who follow him, so there needs to be a voice that opposes his that says "no, SCH and the other healers AREN'T fine", but gl to anyone who attempts to get the following, heh.

It irritates me that "angry healers" is kind of a becoming a meme. Over in the 5.08 update comment thread they joke about how angry healers are going to be that they didn't get any fixes, then the dps mains proceed to complain about how their class still doesn't do enough damage, or feels too clunky to play, or whatever. Are our opinions less valid than theirs (in their eyes) because there are more of us trying to be heard? Because we've been asking for longer and therefore our requests are getting repetitive? Because they don't care about our issues and therefore we are an annoyance?

And yet, because of that perception any healer that tried to get a following being critical of the current healers would be ignored by the non-healer community at best and actively shouted down at worst.

[Sloprano]

It irritates me that "angry healers" is kind of a becoming a meme. Over in the 5.08 update comment thread they joke about how angry healers are going to be that they didn't get any fixes, then the dps mains proceed to complain about how their class still doesn't do enough damage, or feels too clunky to play, or whatever. Are our opinions less valid than theirs (in their eyes) because there are more of us trying to be heard? Because we've been asking for longer and therefore our requests are getting repetitive? Because they don't care about our issues and therefore we are an annoyance?

And yet, because of that perception any healer that tried to get a following being critical of the current healers would be ignored by the non-healer community at best and actively shouted down at worst.

Angry healers have been a long-time thing, have you gotten your "Angry Healers" monthly? To answer your OP, no, I'm still championing for SCH changes though that sort of evolved because I want to have 1. A healer with almost unlimited potential and fights that makes me have to think of how to utilize it all. 2. Fights that require a lot of movement 3. Make all the non-end game content be about the content not the carrot daily reward at the end with random dangerous patrols and chest with random loot and xp.

It has been disheartning to go now two months and neither gotten a concern raised at LLP or even a community manager just popping in going "Hey, how are you enjoying healers?" or "We are not planing any changes right now." The silence is deafing. I am still reminded of how gutted SCH is every time I log in to do stuff with the FC, which is great for taking the mind of, and now even some new players picking up sch are complaining about having nothing to do bu Ruin spam.

It started with Stormblood and I'm still in favor of getting 3.0 Scholar back. I'm more than happy to see Recitation, Catalyze, Fey Blessing, Excog, Fey Union go in return for the versatility of the slow dots, slow/heavy/virus debuffs, pet hotbar with own gcd, Selene. List just keeps on growing. If it is hard to balance around the finely tuned raid fights the current skillset could be a seperate system like PvP they tweak by the numbers.

[Hatstand]

Angry healers have been a long-time thing, have you gotten your "Angry Healers" monthly? To answer your OP, no, I'm still championing for SCH changes though that sort of evolved because I want to have 1. A healer with almost unlimited potential and fights that makes me have to think of how to utilize it all. 2. Fights that require a lot of movement 3. Make all the non-end game content be about the content not the carrot daily reward at the end with random dangerous patrols and chest with random loot and xp.

It has been disheartning to go now two months and neither gotten a concern raised at LLP or even a community manager just popping in going "Hey, how are you enjoying healers?" or "We are not planing any changes right now." The silence is deafing. I am still reminded of how gutted SCH is every time I log in to do stuff with the FC, which is great for taking the mind of, and now even some new players picking up sch are complaining about having nothing to do bu Ruin spam.

It started with Stormblood and I'm still in favor of getting 3.0 Scholar back. I'm more than happy to see Recitation, Catalyze, Fey Blessing, Excog, Fey Union go in return for the versatility of the slow dots, slow/heavy/virus debuffs, pet hotbar with own gcd, Selene. List just keeps on growing. If it is hard to balance around the finely tuned raid fights the current skillset could be a seperate system like PvP they tweak by the numbers.

The only reason I think there would be problems with that is that people would get no practice at their job outside raids, which could be pretty rough. It'd be better if they had some sort of toggle outside raids. Heck, it would be a wonderful function if you could play any version (2.0, 3.0, 4.0, 5.0) of a job outside raids, with just a switch of a toggle. Then you just make it against the code of conduct to bully people for not having the best version in non-endgame content (which would be the only content where you could use it anyway). I'm sure there would be some people who would rage about "not being able to discourage people from being dead weight by playing the wrong spec", but people who'd do that in non-endgame content are toxic anyway, and I have no problem with censoring toxicity.

However, I realise something like this would never happen

[EaMett]

I still try to bring it up where I can, but it's getting disheartening not hearing anything from the devs. "SCH is strong, so it's fine, it's balanced" etc. Completely ignoring all the issues we have with it.

._. I really wish the devs would say ANYTHING. What healers really need is a voice that isn't momo. Momo, as amazing at the game as he is, only cares about optimizing, everything else is second bananas, so long as SCH can optimize and do it well, then it will be fine in his eyes, and it'll be fine in the eyes of the people who follow him, so there needs to be a voice that opposes his that says "no, SCH and the other healers AREN'T fine", but gl to anyone who attempts to get the following, heh.

Momo said sch was fine? I recall him pointing out the fairy issues and the galvanize/catalyze order problem. Also he seems to be running his most successful speed runs on double WHM for the most part, so although that's not an indication that sch isn't alright it's still telling of a bit of a inbalance.

Also people keep complaining about Seraph... Am I the only one that consider it a pretty strong healing move?

I think seraph is fine, it's an ogcd succor shield, I'll take it. I wouldn't call it "strong" by any measure but it compliments the rest of our kit really well and needs a bit of planning. Actually feels nice to use imo as it saves a gcd, but that's only in raiding as it loses most of it's appeal in dungeons.

[Lagomorph]

I've already quit sch. I'd gladly come back to my (former) favorite class if the devs would realize how bad their current vision of the healers actually is.

[Tharnor]

Give up? You make it sound like the class is broken beyond repair. The scholar was not in some rut. We heal and dps just fine and even got our aetherflow dump back. Is it perfect? No but I am not gonna throw a tantrum like many other people on the forums.