Suggestion for: RDM improvements

[Archwizard]

Sure. Why not? Use Displacement if you want to or need to for movement, use Engagement if you want to or need to for mechanics. There shouldn't be a 50 potency penalty because you have to stay in melee range due to platform sizes (I'm thinking E3 and Suzaku) or because you need to stay with the party for stack mechanics or healing, or if you can't leave the area. There's no reason that there should be a difference in potency for those who either choose to stay closer or for time when you must stay closer.

The problem with that is that Displacement isn't DRG's Elusive Jump. It's an instant damage CD, which shares a charge with a damage CD -- and maximum damage from instant CDs will come from using them as soon as they become active, unless they have A) charges so you have an entire CD's leeway on timing or B) mechanics that increase their potency for holding them for an ideal circumstance (which due to them both being physical damage, we don't get from any other abilities). The current disparity between Displacement and Engagement is an ill-fated attempt to induce scenario B.

If Engagement did equal damage to Displacement (or at least near enough as to be inconsequential) and no other changes were made, the only time you would pop Displacement is if it came off cooldown at the EXACT SECOND the boss dropped an AoE marker in the melee -- otherwise, it will never even be available because you'll be using Engagement on CD, especially with your suggestion to make auto-attacks stronger for RDM since you will want to actively avoid jumping backward for the whole 10 sec to greed out maximum damage.
(And bear in mind, the theoretical scenario you suggest where Displacement remains objectively better has to exist in the same realm where current melee jobs are not at a significant disadvantage for lacking similar escape tools. Which only DRG has.)

There would be no "use Displacement when you need to," or at least not with enough frequency to justify it being a separate ability. Displacement may as well be taken off the bar in such a case.

[wereotter]

The problem with that is that Displacement isn't DRG's Elusive Jump. It's an instant damage CD, which shares a charge with a damage CD -- and maximum damage from instant CDs will come from using them as soon as they become active, unless they have A) charges so you have an entire CD's leeway on timing or B) mechanics that increase their potency for holding them for an ideal circumstance (which due to them both being physical damage, we don't get from any other abilities). The current disparity between Displacement and Engagement is an ill-fated attempt to induce scenario B.

If Engagement did equal damage to Displacement (or at least near enough as to be inconsequential) and no other changes were made, the only time you would pop Displacement is if it came off cooldown at the EXACT SECOND the boss dropped an AoE marker in the melee -- otherwise, it will never even be available because you'll be using Engagement on CD, especially with your suggestion to make auto-attacks stronger for RDM since you will want to actively avoid jumping backward for the whole 10 sec to greed out maximum damage.
(And bear in mind, the theoretical scenario you suggest where Displacement remains objectively better has to exist in the same realm where current melee jobs are not at a significant disadvantage for lacking similar escape tools. Which only DRG has.)

There would be no "use Displacement when you need to," or at least not with enough frequency to justify it being a separate ability. Displacement may as well be taken off the bar in such a case.

So delete displacement, or turn it into a simple movement skill with no damage.

I make no hiding that I think it was only an okay skill at best when it was implemented, but causes more trouble than it's worth too often. I've had it launch me off platforms that are too narrow to actually use it more than once, and in open world content, I've had it launch me into enemies in Eureka causing my death when they all get agroed onto me. The game's developers have failed to take this skill into account when designing arenas, and rather than address this, they gave us Engagement, and then made it have less potency. This means that Red Mages have been nerfed for fights where Displacement isn't a viable skill to use, and that's not okay by me.

No other job I can think of gets a damage penalty because of the shape of the platform you're fighting on, so why should Red Mage? If you prefer to be at range, nothing is stopping you from using Displacement to go away if their damage is nearer equal.

[Leidiriv]

So delete displacement, or turn it into a simple movement skill with no damage.

I make no hiding that I think it was only an okay skill at best when it was implemented, but causes more trouble than it's worth too often. I've had it launch me off platforms that are too narrow to actually use it more than once, and in open world content, I've had it launch me into enemies in Eureka causing my death when they all get agroed onto me. The game's developers have failed to take this skill into account when designing arenas, and rather than address this, they gave us Engagement, and then made it have less potency. This means that Red Mages have been nerfed for fights where Displacement isn't a viable skill to use, and that's not okay by me.

No other job I can think of gets a damage penalty because of the shape of the platform you're fighting on, so why should Red Mage? If you prefer to be at range, nothing is stopping you from using Displacement to go away if their damage is nearer equal.

What fights are there where Displacement's not viable? It's easily usable in both EX trials, it's not even a question of "can I use it" in E1S, it's dependent on mechanics and the tank's position in E2S, there's only 1 or 2 spots in E3S where I wouldn't use it (just before any Temporary Current, since that's suicide), and from what I've done so far in E4 (and the videos I've seen) it looks okay there too except for 1 or 2 spots.

[wereotter]

What fights are there where Displacement's not viable? It's easily usable in both EX trials, it's not even a question of "can I use it" in E1S, it's dependent on mechanics and the tank's position in E2S, there's only 1 or 2 spots in E3S where I wouldn't use it (just before any Temporary Current, since that's suicide), and from what I've done so far in E4 (and the videos I've seen) it looks okay there too except for 1 or 2 spots.

E3S isn't not viable when Leviathan splits out the center of the platform.

Suzaku last expansion it wasn't viable since the coin platform you fight on was exactly 15 yalms wide.

These are two fights I can think of off hand, also it does depend on how your rotation is lining up in the fight, but for me, I find that I'm using my melee combo during the panto puddles phase, so if I leap back then, it's the same problem, you either leap back into death or you leap off the platform.

The fact that instances like this even exist, though, is exactly why I argue that the two skills shouldn't have a disparity of damage output. You don't see a skill on any other job that requires you use a different one for less damage when the platform isn't shaped favorably. The closest thing to this I can think of was that in ARR, Leviathan sill has a normal positional ring for his first phase despite the rear positional being inaccessible, and this is something they've changed in fights where you can't reliably hit positionals going forward, think E4S where big titan has an omni-positional hit ring.

[Leidiriv]

E3S isn't not viable when Leviathan splits out the center of the platform.

Suzaku last expansion it wasn't viable since the coin platform you fight on was exactly 15 yalms wide.

These are two fights I can think of off hand, also it does depend on how your rotation is lining up in the fight, but for me, I find that I'm using my melee combo during the panto puddles phase, so if I leap back then, it's the same problem, you either leap back into death or you leap off the platform.

The fact that instances like this even exist, though, is exactly why I argue that the two skills shouldn't have a disparity of damage output. You don't see a skill on any other job that requires you use a different one for less damage when the platform isn't shaped favorably. The closest thing to this I can think of was that in ARR, Leviathan sill has a normal positional ring for his first phase despite the rear positional being inaccessible, and this is something they've changed in fights where you can't reliably hit positionals going forward, think E4S where big titan has an omni-positional hit ring.

Displacing on Leviathan when the platform is split is easy. Just stand on the inner edge and a bit back from Levi's hitbox. For Suzaku, once again just hug the inner ring and Displacement is perfectly safe. Hell, Corps-a-corps is more dangerous than Displacement in those fights.

[Zyneste]

Displacing on Leviathan when the platform is split is easy. Just stand on the inner edge and a bit back from Levi's hitbox. For Suzaku, once again just hug the inner ring and Displacement is perfectly safe. Hell, Corps-a-corps is more dangerous than Displacement in those fights.

I lol'd when he said it was suicide. Its super comfy to do.

[JohnnyDevo]

I lol'd when he said it was suicide. Its super comfy to do.

I scared my raid group by saying "if I die, I die" the first time I did it, but I haven't ever actually fallen off the platform doing it.

[Archwizard]

So delete displacement, or turn it into a simple movement skill with no damage.

And while I agree that making Displacement purely a movement skill would be more effective than what we have now, I should also point out they are more likely to delete Engagement (as a CD that is literally just damage only usable while in melee range, which could be added into other sources of melee damage -- in addition to being our weakest oGCD damage skill that exists purely to bandaid Displacement itself) than Displacement proper.

I make no hiding that I think it was only an okay skill at best when it was implemented, but causes more trouble than it's worth too often. I've had it launch me off platforms that are too narrow to actually use it more than once, and in open world content, I've had it launch me into enemies in Eureka causing my death when they all get agroed onto me. The game's developers have failed to take this skill into account when designing arenas, and rather than address this, they gave us Engagement, and then made it have less potency. This means that Red Mages have been nerfed for fights where Displacement isn't a viable skill to use, and that's not okay by me.

So you want to delete a skill (or at least turn it into dead weight) because you personally can't use it optimally?

It's fair to say other players have similar issues to what you've experienced, but as Leidiriv has pointed out, every scenario where Displacement is "sure" to kill you has workarounds even without Engagement. If anything Engagement is more of a safety tool for when your tank is positioning things badly than when the encounter demands it.

If you prefer to be at range, nothing is stopping you from using Displacement to go away if their damage is nearer equal.

Except that again, you literally also suggested in the same post a means to increase our auto-attack damage so you would want to stay in melee as much as possible.

[wereotter]

Except that again, you literally also suggested in the same post a means to increase our auto-attack damage so you would want to stay in melee as much as possible.

My suggestion was that red mage auto attacks should be increased only for the duration of time that you're in melee range for your rotation, the duration of the buff might have been too long, but the idea was that it triggered upon use of corps-a-corps and was temporary. So again, if you want to stay at range, even with what I suggested, you're not losing out. Or just don't take that suggestion. What I listed is not an all or nothing type of list of what I'd like to see.