Bard's Thematic Future

[SamRF]

Thanks for the polling and sharing results! Very interesting to see.

It was really difficult for me to decide between healer, caster and ranged. I voted for healer but honestly I'd likely change my vote I think considering how healers are designed in this game (right now). Either way, I'd be happy no matter what if we'd get a pure Bard that is a BRD first and foremost.

I understand however that it's pretty unrealistic to expect an actual job split and also understand why people who may have taken a liking with current BRD don't want such drastic thematic change. Considering this and looking at the poll results, the most logical way forward for SE seems to be to simply add more musical and BRD like abilities to the job we currently have. By a lot, I'd say, since many still seem in favor of completely splitting and it won't be easy to satisfy those. They don't necessarily need a ton of extra utility (more than DNC for example) imo but simply more BRD themed animations for DPS abilities as well.

[MartaDemireux]

I understand however that it's pretty unrealistic to expect an actual job split and also understand why people who may have taken a liking with current BRD don't want such drastic thematic change. Considering this and looking at the poll results, the most logical way forward for SE seems to be to simply add more musical and BRD like abilities to the job we currently have. By a lot, I'd say, since many still seem in favor of completely splitting and it won't be easy to satisfy those. They don't necessarily need a ton of extra utility (more than DNC for example) imo but simply more BRD themed animations for DPS abilities as well.

Agreed. And if SE takes this poll into consideration for 6.0, I do believe that we will see more music added to the existing BRD before any of the other options. It's the least difficult and divisive way to please the majority. Adding glamours to ARC abilities with the BRD stone on alone would go a long way toward their thematic identity even if they couldn't figure out a way to add more supportive features to it while differentiating it from DNC.

[Mindiori]

Personally, I heavily favor the hybrid buff/bow thematic. A Bard (in name) is not a Arcane DPS Archer, or Burst cannon as it was in Aion. I've always seen this as implied by the naming convention, as per other jobs.

On a practical level, the 'less' opinionated element to me is that of 'more homogenization'. How lazy, to have a ranged DPS section where the potential to have no real difference sans aesthetics, rears its ugly head again. The idea that Bard/Machinist and Dancer should offer a different approach to the same concept, is a simple case of play diversity and somewhat obvious I feel. Some may not like the vision for their particular class but thats always going to be the case. Most agree, that you will never please everyone. So surely better, to offer a distinctly different type of Rdps across the spectrum. If Dancer supports, Machinist says kapow and Bards walk the line; thats something for the pures and the hybrid fans, all.

For me thats a better balance of diversity and interesting play variance, than having it rendered like the Tanks. Which on current paths, will see everyone with the same 4 buttons reskined to different colours.

[MirronTulaxia]

I'd rather see them just make a new job and refocus Bard into a pure Ranger. I'm not a big fan of the hybrid style they did with Summoner or Bard as is, and it just seems to kind of create a weird space while eating up potential jobs instead.

Granted of course there is the fact that they can only include so many jobs, but in a perfect world I'd rather see a full on Bard/Songstress/whatever job instead.

[MPNZ]

I'd rather see them just make a new job and refocus Bard into a pure Ranger. I'm not a big fan of the hybrid style they did with Summoner or Bard as is, and it just seems to kind of create a weird space while eating up potential jobs instead.

Granted of course there is the fact that they can only include so many jobs, but in a perfect world I'd rather see a full on Bard/Songstress/whatever job instead.

Or....
Ranger
Weapon: magitec Aether-string bow that can seperate into an aether-edge ax and short sword
Abilities: Rune-magic based nature and animal semblances (Hunger of wolf, bear stance, anchor of the great tree, wings of the old one, stealth)

Seriously, FF has mixed jobs and abilities since like FFIII, so why wouldn't it be normal for combat professions to like have diverse skillsets like the priest/champion paladin?

[MirronTulaxia]

Or....
Ranger
Weapon: magitec Aether-string bow that can seperate into an aether-edge ax and short sword
Abilities: Rune-magic based nature and animal semblances (Hunger of wolf, bear stance, anchor of the great tree, wings of the old one, stealth)

Seriously, FF has mixed jobs and abilities since like FFIII, so why wouldn't it be normal for combat professions to like have diverse skillsets like the priest/champion paladin?

FFIII doesn't let you mix jobs. FFV is the first game of the series that lets you mix jobs.

And I'm not really sure I understand how what you proposed is a rebuttal to what I said. I guess the idea being that you want an entirely new Ranger job? For me at least I would rather see Bard get a proper focus than Ranger, I don't really have any interest in it. It's certainly possible they could add Ranger as a Ranged DPS to finish things off, the options for specifically Ranged DPS are somewhat limited, though I could see Gambler I suppose.

Edit: Actually, to expand, there isn't anything wrong with expanding jobs in general. But ultimately this is still a role based game. Whatever job gets added needs to fit those roles. It's much like in FFT Summoners don't regularly hit every character on the field, even though in traditional RPGs that's what they do (Illusionists are basically Summoners and do manage to do that, but your mileage may vary on how much you consider them Summoners as they don't actually summon anything). In this game there are five roles. Jobs need to fit them or be Limited and not worry.

[MPNZ]

FFIII doesn't let you mix jobs. FFV is the first game of the series that lets you mix jobs.

And I'm not really sure I understand how what you proposed is a rebuttal to what I said. I guess the idea being that you want an entirely new Ranger job? For me at least I would rather see Bard get a proper focus than Ranger, I don't really have any interest in it. It's certainly possible they could add Ranger as a Ranged DPS to finish things off, the options for specifically Ranged DPS are somewhat limited, though I could see Gambler I suppose.

Edit: Actually, to expand, there isn't anything wrong with expanding jobs in general. But ultimately this is still a role based game. Whatever job gets added needs to fit those roles. It's much like in FFT Summoners don't regularly hit every character on the field, even though in traditional RPGs that's what they do (Illusionists are basically Summoners and do manage to do that, but your mileage may vary on how much you consider them Summoners as they don't actually summon anything). In this game there are five roles. Jobs need to fit them or be Limited and not worry.

Yeah, I'm probably thinking of the onion knight, which usually allows for that.

TLDR: a lot of players see making ranger impossible due to Brd using a bow when 2.5 mages use a staff, or just because of pigeonholing. It's a total lack of imagination and like "the nail that stands out gets hammered first" thing. The above is literally a cookie-cutter ranger with a european shamanistic element and a unique weapon that was also meant to bring to mind RDM

[Klaleara]

I love the hybrid aspect of it. I wish there were more hybrid characters.

[TabrisOmbrelame]

I'd love to see something as a "Singing healer".

Using the voice to heal makes things different of Bard and Dancer simply cause one play an instrument and the other one is just dancing. But no one is actually singing.

You can even make a joke spell about that, one that push back the enemy, named FUS RO DAH (Yeah I know, wrong game boy)

Althought, damaging people while using your voice... Seems like your voices is so horrible to hear that monster start to bleed from the ears xD

[MirronTulaxia]

Yeah, I'm probably thinking of the onion knight, which usually allows for that.

TLDR: a lot of players see making ranger impossible due to Brd using a bow when 2.5 mages use a staff, or just because of pigeonholing. It's a total lack of imagination and like "the nail that stands out gets hammered first" thing. The above is literally a cookie-cutter ranger with a european shamanistic element and a unique weapon that was also meant to bring to mind RDM

Even Onion Knight doesn't mix and match jobs so much as is a job with a broad moveset in some versions.

And I don't think Ranger is impossible because it shares a weapon. More than Black/White/Blue Mage all using staves (and Red sometimes), we also have a lot of swords. We could very easily see Ranger. I think the question is if there is enough drive for a Ranger job when we have Bard. From what I can tell more people would rather see a new Bard as the current one doesn't really hit the themes for Bard as well, while compared to Ranger Bard (XIV) hits the themes pretty close. Doesn't help that as a job all it really has to its name pretty much is "uses a bow" like a number of FF physical jobs.