Ranged DPS role is about to be excluded from all content

[CKNovel]

Did groups even take triple melees for Ultimate UCoB/UwU clears? Also, who is going to do mechanics with 2 melees and 2 black mages? Making both healers do all the mechanics might not be an option.

UCOB and UWU were during Stormblood, not Shadowbringers.
Back then Bard/MCH were almost mandatory due to their utility, with an insane popularity for the Bards (Wasn't it the most played job in SB?).

Bard gave 2% crit to all its teammates when breathing. MCH would increase the party damage by 5% for 30s every 120s
MCH could reduce by 10% damage dealt by a boss every 60 seconds. Bard had a longer cooldown (4.X Troubadour) basically lasting longer every 120s.
Ranged had a fair tax, melee were not as broken as we currently know and we didn't had a way to know the rDPS

[Kabooa]

Ranged had a fair tax, melee were not as broken as we currently know and we didn't had a way to know the rDPS

There was an app that approximated it. We had about an accurate a measurement as we do now, it's just easier for the layman to see.

Ranged had a fair tax until Piercing Down was brought into the picture, then they were busted as !@#%.

[HyoMinPark]

There was an app that approximated it. We had about an accurate a measurement as we do now, it's just easier for the layman to see.

Ranged had a fair tax until Piercing Down was brought into the picture, then they were busted as !@#%.

Honestly, the physical ranged being busted because of piercing was the developer’s own fault: they actively admitted that they didn’t balance BRD or MCH around piercing back in Stormblood.

[Akiudo]

UCOB and UWU were during Stormblood, not Shadowbringers.
Back then Bard/MCH were almost mandatory due to their utility, with an insane popularity for the Bards (Wasn't it the most played job in SB?).

Bard gave 2% crit to all its teammates when breathing. MCH would increase the party damage by 5% for 30s every 120s
MCH could reduce by 10% damage dealt by a boss every 60 seconds. Bard had a longer cooldown (4.X Troubadour) basically lasting longer every 120s.
Ranged had a fair tax, melee were not as broken as we currently know and we didn't had a way to know the rDPS

theres also the fact that the very notion of "tripple melee" is something that should be burned for even being brought up, that would literally mean giving 75% of the available spots to 40% of jobs. If we really go by "take the player, not the job" we would aim for 1/1/1 +the last dps spot being able to be filled by any class.

Now lets for once not discuss the whole "but if phys ranged where good enough the sky would fall and no one would take melee anymore" and lets simply take 2/1/1 as working as intendet and the best that will ever be done, at this point melee are allready overrepresented compared to the other roles, so the allready accepted overrepresantation getting worse even being something thought up as possible if unlikely is bad enough.

Also,

who is going to do mechanics with 2 melees and 2 black mages? Making both healers do all the mechanics might not be an option.

i dunno, the blackmages ? you know, the casters that at this point have the most on demand free movement of them all and still get cited as the turret class that can't move worth **** ?i mean if there is a mechanic for 2 people at least one of them would do it either way, no ? unless you think taking 2 physical ranged is anywhere in the range of viable right now

[lulunami]

Lets be honest. Black mages do not want to mechanics unless they are forced to. Even with the addition of Xenoglossy and the 30 sec Sharpcast.

[Dogempire]

Lets be honest. Black mages do not want to mechanics unless they are forced to. Even with the addition of Xenoglossy and the 30 sec Sharpcast.

I mean yes, but they have more mobility when they're forced to move than red mage does but has a lot more damage. Plus even if they lose a gcd or two they'll still easily be on par with ranged/the other casters.

[Kimstar]

Me, a casual. Yeah i play this game for glam tbh.

[Mistyregions]

Isnt is supposed to be, let's say a MCH does 10k dps a second no utility. Then dancer and bard do 8k but bring a dmg buff that can bring the other players dps up by 285.714285714 dps? I imagine that math cant be to hard to figure out, and with the role bonuses of not double stacking you would lose dps bringing two utility classes.

[JanVanding]

I agree with this. Overrall the ranged are really close to each others.
DNC needs a slight potency buff and tweaks. But the ranged overrall have their strength and weaknesses that put them on equal foot.

For example, BRD and DNC will shine when there is multiple target while the MCH will shine against a unique target.
Rangeds, however, are bad when put in competition with all others DPS, utility and mobility included

Potency buffs should be without question for DNC and RDM because they aren't true range for a start, they're middle distance (between the range and the melee dps due to their big damage requiring them to get into melee range) thus the relative safety of standing at max distance and occasionally moving is gone.

I'd argue the RDM needs a fair bit more potency as their dash/escape is a lot more restricted in its movement sphere compared to the DNC En Avant. Especially once the DNC has access to stacks and there's not really much you can do in terms of tweaking their kit outside mana balance meter generation to make them better without changing the class fundamentally (DNC can easily have some of the RNG removed and be in a solid spot, RDM would just become a BLM with close ranged burst, dual cast and better mobility).

So potency tweak for RDM and add some extra balance meter generation on each skill and see where it goes.
Potency tweak, remove RNG from flourishing cascade, rising windmill and guarantee feather generation on fountain fall and bloodshower for DNC and both of those two should be in a great spot.

I don't want them to go too overboard with potency numbers for DNC though, slight tweaks for those, the RNG tuning is far more important to make the class flow as it should. The DNC has lots of potential, it's just not realized with all the gating.

[WalxAtNite]

Here's how I've always looked at this:

Theoretically, if you put the bottom 5 in a group in front of EX or Savage content - ONLY the bottom 5 - could they clear it if they played at the high end of the median percentile for their jobs and followed mechanics?

If yes, but they'd struggle and need to be in the 75th to 80th percentile? - no changes needed.

If no unless they all play 100% perfectly and not even the 80th percentile gets them through a DPS check? - they need a boost.

SE does not intend to have ONLY those jobs in content. I understand that. However, the way I see it, if you wanted to make a premade with JUST the bottom 5 DPS jobs but you cannot because the content would legit be impossible, then something is broken. Done this way, other jobs' DPS doesn't even matter. It's a test as to whether these 5 jobs have enough oomph.

In other words, top DPS isn't everything to me, but I need to be able to clear content.