Where is my level sync

[Sephr]

People talk up level sync, about how it "helped low level parties". However, at the same time, it all but killed high level parties. Most players, the majority, easily... never touched high level areas after they realized they could just sync their way to 75 in Qufim.

This happened for two reasons:
1) People who only cared about getting xp as fast and easily as possible, immediately took to it.
2) People who didn't want to do it, or at least not all the time, almost had no choice but to go along with it, 'cause putting together higher level parties became *extremely* difficult, even by XI standards.

I tried to "take the initiative" and form parties to go to other, more level-appropriate areas, because I got sick of looking at the same 2 or 3 places every single party... among other reasons. I could only occasionally get a group of people where everyone was interested, or at least open to the idea of leveling in different, more level appropriate areas... you know, like we used to. In most cases, at least 2-3 of the people insisted on level sync'ing in Qufim or some other low-level area, or they wouldn't join.

Level Sync was an example of SE having a good idea, and having their heart in the right place, but fumbling it on execution. I have no problem with a system that allows friends or siblings to play together when there are many levels between them. However, in XI, SE did not think or plan it through very thoroughly.

If they do implement level sync'ing, then I seriously hope there are more restrictions and limitations on how much or how quickly one can progress while sync'd, else we're just gonna see the same abuse happen here. SE needs to maintain some kind of benefit to leveling on higher tier, level-appropriate mobs, to keep people from turning some lower level area in XIV into another Qufim Island.

People are quick to argue that the low-end game shouldn't suffer as people progress. This is true. But by the same token, the high level game shouldn't become all but redundant at the expense of the low level game either.

On the other hand, if they'd balanced things so that rewards reflected effort more, it wouldn't have been such an issue. Capping xp at 300 or whatever no matter what you fought and what level it was really didn't make sense. If for example, they'd made xp per level increase more than it did, and increased the xp per mob (and had xp reflect more accurately than just level, some enemies were MUCH more challenging than others) as you levelled up in a similar way people would be less inclined to want to sync.

[Preypacer]

On the other hand, if they'd balanced things so that rewards reflected effort more, it wouldn't have been such an issue. Capping xp at 300 or whatever no matter what you fought and what level it was really didn't make sense. If for example, they'd made xp per level increase more than it did, and increased the xp per mob (and had xp reflect more accurately than just level, some enemies were MUCH more challenging than others) as you levelled up in a similar way people would be less inclined to want to sync.

Then perhaps that's something for them to keep in mind.

Of course, it still comes down to perspective.

If SE can find a way to keep content appealing at all ranges, and not let sync'ing turn into "faster and easier xp", making it the only thing people want to do... I'm all for it.

In principle, it sounds good... I have a sister who will be starting the game in a few months, probably. I'd like to be able to group up with her as well. In that capacity - what it's ostensibly intended for - it would certainly work.

I'd be fine with a sort of "sliding scale" SP system. For every, say 8-10 levels you are above the one you're sync'ing down to, the SP rate drops by a certain %. If people's *true* intent - as many have professed on this thread, and elsewhere - is to be able to group up with friends and family members who would otherwise be too far apart... Then that should not be a problem. You're still getting SP for your effort, and you're getting to do what - again, per many people's claims - you want to, which is hang out and do stuff with your friend/sibling.

Also, you're already higher level and so, for you to gain sp at a slower rate would allow your sibling to catch up to you that much more quickly since they're still gaining at normal rate.

I would see no problem with that.

However, I have a feeling many others would scoff at that, because "hanging out with friends and family members" is not their concern. Leveling as quickly and easily as possible is. Certainly, no one believes that the hundreds, even thousands, of people who planted themselves in Qufim and sync'd down for party after party were all either related or "best buddies". I don't think anyone's that naive.

I will not be surprised if someone says "Well in that case, the lower level should get sp faster so they can catch up more quickly...". No. That would then turn the system into a power-leveler's wet dream that would be abused to hell and back.

I'm not against sync'ing. I'm against it being abused and ruining the higher, and even mid-level game as it did in XI.

If/When SE decides to implement such a system, I just hope they take the time to "think like a player who's only looking for a faster/easer way to level while bypassing other content". They need to identify and close any loopholes or weaknesses in it that people would most certainly exploit or abuse.

[Rydin]

I can see both sides of it... what about a happy compromise...
Only classes above a certain level can level sync (Even something like R50 only). Instead of receiving EXP or SP you get some type of Merit-like points

[Engineer]

I can see both sides of it... what about a happy compromise...
Only classes above a certain level can level sync (Even something like R50 only). Instead of receiving EXP or SP you get some type of Merit-like points

That wpould be horrible, there is nothing wrong with level sync in XIV. Everyone is looking at it as if this is final fantasy xi again. Its a different game. Non of the cons will carry over to XIV.

Also. If a player wants to lvl at a low level area to 50 let him do that, its no ones business what he does..

[Preypacer]

That wpould be horrible, there is nothing wrong with level sync in XIV. Everyone is looking at it as if this is final fantasy xi again. Its a different game. Non of the cons will carry over to XIV.

Also. If a player wants to lvl at a low level area to 50 let him do that, its no ones business what he does..

Again, you don't know this because you don't know how SE would implement it and, as a result, how the players would twist it around into some new "speed-leveling" system that has nothing to do with what it was intended for.

Level Sync in FFXI was intended to help people who were too far apart in level play together... friends, etc. That was the *idea*.

What it became was basically a game-changing system that turned the entire process of leveling - for pretty much everyone - on its head.

What's funny is, there are people in this thread saying "I only want to be able to level with my friend/sibling. As long as I can do that, I'm fine with any limitations".

The immediate response from others is "No! No limitations!" Can you guess what those people have in mind? I'd bet a week's pay it's "turning level sync into a new speed-leveling approach".

If SE implements sync in such a way that it truly benefits those who are merely looking to close the gap between themselves and friends, LS-mates and siblings who are too far apart in level... but no more... Then I see no problem with it.

If they implement it so openly that it's abused as it was in XI, all but killing high level parties in its wake... Then I say "hell no".

[IStolzI]

I don't see how level sync is needed in this game. The current system allows for plenty room to party with your friends. A 45 can group with 30s and get the 30s nice sp while still netting 80~ a kill for himself. It's not the fastest SP possible, but it is reasonable. If your being held back from pting with your friends because maximizing SP income is priority, that's your fault not the game's. XI on the other hand, you could be partying and someone would lvl up to the magically level where mobs start to check "tough" maybe "very tough" and if you dont move zones or replace everyone's xp is immediately ruined, that's why THAT game needed level sync.

[Engineer]

I don't see how level sync is needed in this game. The current system allows for plenty room to party with your friends. A 45 can group with 30s and get the 30s nice sp while still netting 80~ a kill for himself. It's not the fastest SP possible, but it is reasonable. If your being held back from pting with your friends because maximizing SP income is priority, that's your fault not the game's. XI on the other hand, you could be partying and someone would lvl up to the magically level where mobs start to check "tough" maybe "very tough" and if you dont move zones or replace everyone's xp is immediately ruined, that's why THAT game needed level sync.

The thing that bugs me is people dont want level sync because they dont want other players to use it. If you dont want to use it, dont use it. I think its selfish, like if someone sais they dont want it because someone is going to only lvl in the low lvl area, thats dumb, WHY WOULD YOU CARE WHAT THEY DO? if thats what they want to do, leave them alone.

And also people need to understand that SE is putting it in regardless of what anyone sais. too bad its coming.

Why?

Because this game is very casual friendly, and would benefit from it.

So instead of being selfish and saying you dont want, just realise you dont have to use it.

[Preypacer]

The thing that bugs me is people dont want level sync because they dont want other players to use it. If you dont want to use it, dont use it. I think its selfish, like if someone sais they dont want it because someone is going to only lvl in the low lvl area, thats dumb, WHY WOULD YOU CARE WHAT THEY DO? if thats what they want to do, leave them alone.

And also people need to understand that SE is putting it in regardless of what anyone sais. too bad its coming.

Why?

Because this game is very casual friendly, and would benefit from it.

So instead of being selfish and saying you dont want, just realise you dont have to use it.

I can answer that question... Because it's not as simple as "don't do it if you don't like it"

Because in FFXI it all but killed mid and higher level parties. I would try to get xp parties in areas like the Jungles and up and couldn't. Why? Because too many people wanted to level sync down and xp to cap in Qufim Island.

I tried putting parties together and, 9 times out of 10 - easily - it was like pulling teeth to get everyone in the group to agree that, yes, we really could get a full party of the same level range and go xp in a level-appropriate location. Once "level sync fever" took hold, it was nigh on impossible to get people out of that mindset and remind them that, yes, once upon a time, people really did level in higher level areas and didn't do all their xp'ing capped down to level ~20-30.

In many cases, I couldn't even put together a full party because at least 1 or 2 people would always argue that we should go to a lower level area (ie. Qufim - even the Dunes a number of times) so we could level sync... because they wanted to work on a lower level job, or xp on easier mobs.

After a time, you had the choice of either stand around and wait for, or try to put together a group that may, or may not ever come together. Or, throw your hands up and go join a level-sync party.

It's the same "flock of sheep" mentality that ruled so many other aspects of the game... people insisting that "/NIN" was the only feasible sub-job in so many cases being another example.

It's the same willfully-ignorant flock of sheep mentality that led people to believe that "you need a Power Leveler to get through the Dunes" when you most certainly don't, and never did. Plenty of people knew this, but it was much easier to just accept it and join xp parties with a PL than it was to wait around for one that didnt' have one, or that didn't have members who - again, like the level-sync'ing situation - insist that your party must have a PL or it would suck and they wouldn't join.

The argument that "there are no skillups like in FFXI" is actually kind of a laughable non-point to bring up, especially how often I see it brought up. The presence of skillups in XI didn't stop people from sync'ing anyway. Not by a long-shot. People didn't care about their skills falling behind because they're stuck in this mindset of "xp-rate and levels are all that matter".

People sync'd religiously in XI even to the point of giving them selves *twice* the work to do; level-sync to 75, then go back and grind up 50+ job levels' worth of skills in Boyahda or Kuftal, which were often over-camped.

Further, SE eventually changed gear to "sync down" along with the player, so "gear level" was no longer an issue either. So that's another non-point where XI is concerned.

Anyway, at the end of the day, it very well can have an effect, and has had an effect on other players, even if they don't want to participate.

I know it's fashionable for some of the "pro-casual" players to pull the whole "casuals shouldn't be punished for the sake of non-casuals!"

Well it works the other way, too... the non-casuals shouldn't be short-handed for the sake of casuals either. After all, they bought the game, too. They'll (eventually) be paying the same sub fee.

If SE implements it in a way that it's truly used for what many proponents *claim* they want it for - to be able to level with their friends/relatives - then I'd be all for it being limited in a way where the higher level players xp gain is capped. This way, the people who are truly eager to be able to xp with their buddies and not have to 'wait for them to catch up', can do so... and meanwhile it wouldn't be abused as a way to power-level again, ending up in a repeat of FFXI.

If people are *truly* only interested in hanging with friends/family with lower level characters, and aren't at all looking at it as a way to power-level their characters more quickly/easily... then certainly there shouldn't be any objection to such a setup.

Of course, I know as well as everyone else that's *not* the case. I can just about imagine the outcry on these forums if SE announced a system that capped the higher level player's xp when sync'd down so it couldn't be abused for power-leveling. The "outrage" would reach the heavens.

So anyway... "If you don't like level sync'ing then don't do it". Yeah. I tried that in XI. It didn't quite work out.

[indira]

level sync is what made FFXI go to crap, and it will kill this game fast since you exp alot faster than ffxi.

[Kailok]

level sync is what made FFXI go to crap, and it will kill this game fast since you exp alot faster than ffxi.

Well, yes, EXP rates would need to be rebalanced so that lower level players aren't receiving higher amounts of XP per kill than the higher levels. I actually just recently made a post about how they need to fix this. In no other game do you make more EXP at level 1 than you do near level cap. It's nonsense.

However, not trying to be rude, but your opinion on Level Sync making FFXI "go to crap", is just that: an opinion. It was a godsend for me and my friends because it gave us the chance to play an MMO together without worrying about "WTF dude you leveled without us!" instances. Seeing as there are no "skill ups" in this game, I don't see how it can "ruin" your game-play experience other than the broken EXP system we currently have.