Eden Savage Coffers

[JohnnyDevo]

Multiple rolls of the same items/class had always a pretty low chance
Getting more then 1 reward is 1/8 chances on every item.

I'm not seeing the difference. 3 items drop, 1/7 to get 1 in your class, 1/49 to get 2 in your class, 1/343 for all 3 of them to be in your class.

for current system, 1/8 to win 1 coffer, 1/64 to win 2 coffers, 1/512 to win 3 coffers.

Being able to need all 3 coffers is nil, because there has always been a chance to win all the loot by default of the server just handing them to you. The only difference is that now we get to pick what piece we get after we win the coffer. I don't know how anyone can argue that the old system is in any way better.

[EchuKayu]

The new system isn't the problem people have. The problem is the fact that it severely punishes people who pug, in that one person can get all the loot. The bigger issue is one person can get unlucky and get no loot for weeks, maybe even none at all. Even if people don't need that loot, they can go in on their off job and, rightfully so, need and get it over someone who hasn't even geared their main job.

And the last issue is that, if you're unlucky in a fight while pugging in e3s, it takes EIGHT WEEKS. What good are the pants from e3s in helping me kill, say, e4s, which is much more difficult, 8 weeks later? This is even worse when you consider it takes 4 pages for 1 accessory, so 20 weeks total if you're really unlucky. It's also ignoring the items required, which take 4 pages, to upgrade to deepshadow from tome gear. It's like intentionally making it obnoxious in an already somewhat unpleasant pug experience to obtain gear, just so people keep playing the game. I'll have all my gear... right in time for the newest Eden raid

You could consider lowering the amount of pages it takes, you could give 1 additional page to anyone who doesn't receive loot that ISN'T a piece of wearable gear, and you most certainly can limit loot to 1 item, regardless of what it is, per person. It's still far better than the complete RNG of the old system, it's far better if you're in a static. It's better in a pug in the former, and absolutely miserable in the latter.

[Nora_of_Mira]

The new system isn't the problem people have. The problem is the fact that it severely punishes people who pug, in that one person can get all the loot. The bigger issue is one person can get unlucky and get no loot for weeks, maybe even none at all. Even if people don't need that loot, they can go in on their off job and, rightfully so, need and get it over someone who hasn't even geared their main job.

I can guarantee Square doesn't view this as a "problem". Anyone who joins party, PUG or Sub or Static, and clears a fight, deserves a fair shake at the rewards that drops. Even if they were carried or died a lot, they contributed the fight in someway that lead to the clear and deserve the chance at the loot.

Anecdotally, my 7/8 static has had to pick up a random healer every week since week 1 and every single week so far, the random healer has walked away with at least 1 item. As a team, this is a loss as that gear no longer contributes to our team's DPS the following week, but it helps that random person and w/e party they join next week. Even though we WANT to vilify these "PUG thieves", we all know we wouldnt have cleared w/o them and they deserve a fair shot at the loot like all of us.

[Sebazy]

There's one big problem with the math getting thrown around suggesting this is better for pugs.

With the old system, the worse off your gear was and the later you tackled the content, the more likely you were to only need to worry about gear type RNG with less chance of actually needing to roll against anyone else for the drop.

If I take a healer friend into a pug and I'm fully geared whilst they have nothing, between us we can guarantee that they will get any healer gear that drops.

With the current system, they could literally be losing rolls to people who are just going to throw the coffers on their retainer. A large chunk of people will just habitually roll need on everything regardless or not of if they are going to ever actually use it.

Basically, this system is going to make it considerably harder to gear up for people in random PF pugs who are trying catch up late in the tier. I'm not a fan of that.

[ForteNightshade]

There's one big problem with the math getting thrown around suggesting this is better for pugs.

With the old system, the worse off your gear was and the later you tackled the content, the more likely you were to only need to worry about gear type RNG with less chance of actually needing to roll against anyone else for the drop.

If I take a healer friend into a pug and I'm fully geared whilst they have nothing, between us we can guarantee that they will get any healer gear that drops.

With the current system, they could literally be losing rolls to people who are just going to throw the coffers on their retainer. A large chunk of people will just habitually roll need on everything regardless or not of if they are going to ever actually use it.

Basically, this system is going to make it considerably harder to gear up for people in random PF pugs who are trying catch up late in the tier. I'm not a fan of that.

This is what definitely needs some adjustments. I just hope they tweak the current system instead of going back because it was extremely annoying to go week after week getting gear that was literally hitting the floor.

[Driavna]

This is what definitely needs some adjustments. I just hope they tweak the current system instead of going back because it was extremely annoying to go week after week getting gear that was literally hitting the floor.

We are more likely to end with personal loot were everyone has a flat chance to win whatever item. After all, some are also complaining that statics are "discriminating" against certain roles and it's "not fair".

IMO we already have the tools to set a group that use whatever loot rules we want (could be using master loot or find/create a static), but it seems that most people in this topic don't want to deal with the extra hassle. I get why but I don't think SE has to do anything in particular outside what they have already done. In my personal experience, no matter the loot distribution, you will have people unhappy about it. (Oh, the good old drama around DKP systems!)

[ForteNightshade]

We are more likely to end with personal loot were everyone has a flat chance to win whatever item. After all, some are also complaining that statics are "discriminating" against certain roles and it's "not fair".

IMO we already have the tools to set a group that use whatever loot rules we want (could be using master loot or find/create a static), but it seems that most people in this topic don't want to deal with the extra hassle. I get why but I don't think SE has to do anything in particular outside what they have already done. In my personal experience, no matter the loot distribution, you will have people unhappy about it. (Oh, the good old drama around DKP systems!)

I mean, I wouldn't be opposed to personal loot drops, though they would have to reduce it to a single drop per week otherwise we would be gearing up way too fast. That being said, people complaining about loot distribution need to either speak up in their static or find another one. It makes far more sense to gear DPS first, but plenty of groups don't do that.

[JohnnyDevo]

There's one big problem with the math getting thrown around suggesting this is better for pugs.

With the old system, the worse off your gear was and the later you tackled the content, the more likely you were to only need to worry about gear type RNG with less chance of actually needing to roll against anyone else for the drop.

If I take a healer friend into a pug and I'm fully geared whilst they have nothing, between us we can guarantee that they will get any healer gear that drops.

With the current system, they could literally be losing rolls to people who are just going to throw the coffers on their retainer. A large chunk of people will just habitually roll need on everything regardless or not of if they are going to ever actually use it.

Basically, this system is going to make it considerably harder to gear up for people in random PF pugs who are trying catch up late in the tier. I'm not a fan of that.

That doesn't change the fact that it used to be 1/14 for healers and gaming it so that he's the only healer who still needs gear still kept it at 1/7 chance for a healer item to drop in the first place.

[Sebazy]

And why should the less geared player that decided to tackle the content later have a higher chance to get the loot exactly?

I'd argue that they deserve the gear more than my retainer.

that's not how coffers work. they can't pre-program them.

That'd be a decent idea for pugs though. Effectively having the coffer auto open in your inventory there and then. If you can't use the item, you probably shouldn't be rolling Need on it.

[ValkyrieL]

Someone already mentioned a great suggestion,


Everyone can need everything but once a roll is won the rest of needs are automatically changed to greed.