Toxic Mentor Problem

[Nariel]

Then how do you differentiate between someone that's a mentor and someone that isn't? I actually have been asked questions before because I leave the status set.

Mentor that want to help novice can use the chanel and you don't need the mentor status to give advice in instances anyway. But I'd say the ridiculous/not-a-crown icon is a middle ground, but its hopping people vanity won't take any icon as long as it make them look "superior".

I don't know if actual novice get the memo about "that guy with a crown is a mentor, ask him for help if you need". I've yet to see someone asking me for advice outside of the chanel.

The best course of action would be giving an incensitive to mentoring so they have to actualy be nice to get a cool crown, like an icon that get flashier/cooler as you get mentor commendation but its a bit redundent with the actual commendation system that reward you for playing heal or tank.

[Iscah]

I don't know if actual novice get the memo about "that guy with a crown is a mentor, ask him for help if you need". I've yet to see someone asking me for advice outside of the chanel.

You definitely still get it as a new player - though personally I wouldn't feel comfortable about approaching a random person for help, and you can't actually get into the Novice Network without being directly invited to it.

[Nariel]

You definitely still get it as a new player - though personally I wouldn't feel comfortable about approaching a random person for help, and you can't actually get into the Novice Network without being directly invited to it.

Thanks for the intel ! Its a bit awkward too to ask for an invitation at start I guess, a novice kinda have to hope a mentor have the habit to do it. Wich is risky too because of the risk of invinting a rmt bot. I can't see another way around that said. You can't give the novice the ability to join because of bots without a AI-proof system...

As a thumb rule I let the fights goes to let people learn by themselves and because its easier to give advice and strat info about something he saw rather than something he'll perceive as abstract and if the novice/first timer get some difficulty I start giving advice here and there depending on the problem.

[EaMett]

I've never had that many issues with mentors. When you do, it does stand out though. I just think this is survivors bias and people remember the bad encounters more than the normal ones.

The vast majority of mentors I've played with these past 4 years are just silent. That's like 90% of them (and we're talking hundreds if not thousands of encounters). The idea that over half of them are bad is an absolutely ridiculous claim. They're just there and do their thing. If you ask they will give advice, but otherwise nada. Every now and then some idiot is an ass and that's that. Every now and then you get a really good mentor with a welcome message and endless patience, and that's that.
All the others know better than to give unsolicited advice and stay quiet (if you're a mentor that cares to help others you know exactly what I'm talking about).

Your mileage may vary depending on your datacenter and probably personal skill as well. But honestly there's no way the situation is as grim as many make it out to be. It's all survivor bias.

[rachcouture]

Mentor that want to help novice can use the chanel and you don't need the mentor status to give advice in instances anyway. But I'd say the ridiculous/not-a-crown icon is a middle ground, but its hopping people vanity won't take any icon as long as it make them look "superior".

I don't know if actual novice get the memo about "that guy with a crown is a mentor, ask him for help if you need". I've yet to see someone asking me for advice outside of the chanel.

The best course of action would be giving an incensitive to mentoring so they have to actualy be nice to get a cool crown, like an icon that get flashier/cooler as you get mentor commendation but its a bit redundent with the actual commendation system that reward you for playing heal or tank.

And if you're not in the novice network (like a lot of people; I really do not need a server-wide channel in my chat log), which doesn't help when you're in a duty, anyway, where advice is most helpful?

Just because you're under this misguided notion that people only ever want the crown for vanity (I'd argue no one does, at least not a significant amount), doesn't mean it isn't useful.

Commendations really don't matter; they're handed out on a personal, subjective basis, where as the Mentor system is based on an objective system.

The vast majority of mentors I've played with these past 4 years are just silent. That's like 90% of them (and we're talking hundreds if not thousands of encounters).

Probably because we tend to either get ignored or even yelled at for offering friendly advice, and I know that at least in my case, I don't want to insult anyone by assuming they don't already know what to do. It's why communication is important; nobody can read minds.

[Nariel]

And if you're not in the novice network (like a lot of people; I really do not need a server-wide channel in my chat log), which doesn't help when you're in a duty, anyway, where advice is most helpful?

Just because you're under this misguided notion that people only ever want the crown for vanity (I'd argue no one does, at least not a significant amount), doesn't mean it isn't useful.

Commendations really don't matter; they're handed out on a personal, subjective basis, where as the Mentor system is based on an objective system.



Probably because we tend to either get ignored or even yelled at for offering friendly advice, and I know that at least in my case, I don't want to insult anyone by assuming they don't already know what to do. It's why communication is important; nobody can read minds.

Yeah I know how usefull it could be if it was an actual indicator of having a mentor willing to help in your party, but it isn't. And not to be rude but, thinking majority of mentor aren't just picking it for the crown is being deluded. Its how its always been, ever.

I never once been harassed for giving advice, ignored yes but never got any virulent reaction to it.

[Stanelis]

I've never had that many issues with mentors. When you do, it does stand out though. I just think this is survivors bias and people remember the bad encounters more than the normal ones.

The vast majority of mentors I've played with these past 4 years are just silent. That's like 90% of them (and we're talking hundreds if not thousands of encounters). The idea that over half of them are bad is an absolutely ridiculous claim. They're just there and do their thing. If you ask they will give advice, but otherwise nada. Every now and then some idiot is an ass and that's that. Every now and then you get a really good mentor with a welcome message and endless patience, and that's that.
All the others know better than to give unsolicited advice and stay quiet (if you're a mentor that cares to help others you know exactly what I'm talking about).

Your mileage may vary depending on your datacenter and probably personal skill as well. But honestly there's no way the situation is as grim as many make it out to be. It's all survivor bias.

That's generally what I do until I notice someone (not) doing domething he really should(n't) be doing or several wipe for the same reason occurs.

Also on some duties some people may say he is knew but in a lot of cases it is better to simply do a blind pull for the player to see the encounter than trying to explain all the shapes of the AOEs he ll have to dodge.

[SomeRandomHuman]

The toxicity is from both sides equally. You have mentors that only want the rewards from it, which they should remove since its only attracted the wrong crowd, and then you have the sprouts that are stuck-up/stubborn/unwilling to listen/take constructive criticism or just get offended by the slightest sign of a helping hand about anything.

Honestly the system itself has been turned to garbage because the NA community tends to lean more towards individualism while the idea and concepts of NN are more communal. I've heard the NN in EU and JP is far better than NA since the culture is more friendly to communal things.

[kidalutz]

Give mentors a cacutar icon.

[Nariel]

Give mentors a cacutar icon.

Love this idea.