Probably a dumb idea on class balance.

[CorbinDallas]

That is the complete opposite of balance. Why should an easy to play job do the same amount of damage as a difficult job.

[DPZ2]

That is the complete opposite of balance. Why should an easy to play job do the same amount of damage as a difficult job.

Define 'easy to play job', given that everyone is pretty much limited by the GCD/oGCD attack cycle.

As an example, Bard had a plethora of buttons to push in a relatively complex priority-list all the way through two expansions, but did way less damage than jobs with a much simpler rotation.

[CorbinDallas]

Define 'easy to play job', given that everyone is pretty much limited by the GCD/oGCD attack cycle.

As an example, Bard had a plethora of buttons to push in a relatively complex priority-list all the way through two expansions, but did way less damage than jobs with a much simpler rotation.

Red Mage vs Summoner, for one. Red Mage is completely brain dead to play at an acceptable level, and nobody can change my mind on that. Compare it to Summoner, which has a rotation that is literally giving people hand cramps. Why should Red Mage do more damage than a Summoner? Give me one good reason.

[DPZ2]

Red Mage vs Summoner, for one. Red Mage is completely brain dead to play at an acceptable level, and nobody can change my mind on that. Compare it to Summoner, which has a rotation that is literally giving people hand cramps. Why should Red Mage do more damage than a Summoner? Give me one good reason.

I play both. Haven't really noticed that Red Mage is completely brain dead to play. Can't speak to the damage either, as the Red Mage is still stuck in the mid-50s. The game play of Summoner is more like that of Bard in that the priority-list can be relatively complex. I'm used to that after more than four years of playing it. I suspect for me it is now what you might call brain dead to play, whereas I have to pay attention with the Red Mage.

Can't give you a good reason behind damage, but then again, why should the relatively simpler Black Mage do more damage? Or the 'strictly by the book" rotation of the Dragoon? Heck, why doesn't Bard do more damage as a DPS than any other DPS, given its complexity. I suspect the answer is that (a) you don't do damage in an instance if you can't pay attention to mechanics and end up dead (b) complexity of play style appeals to people who don't really care if they do 500 less damage per second in the instances where they hang out (c) some jobs appear to do more damage because they have more highly skilled players setting the trend for 'DPS of the expansion?

[SendohJin]

I play both. Haven't really noticed that Red Mage is completely brain dead to play. Can't speak to the damage either, as the Red Mage is still stuck in the mid-50s.

Probably not your topic until you've at least played both at level cap.

[Eli85]

Red Mage vs Summoner, for one. Red Mage is completely brain dead to play at an acceptable level, and nobody can change my mind on that. Compare it to Summoner, which has a rotation that is literally giving people hand cramps. Why should Red Mage do more damage than a Summoner? Give me one good reason.

Red Mage does not do more damage than Summoner.


https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statistics/29#dataset=99


I've chosen the 99th percentile to eliminate the discrepancies between player skill levels. Whether it is raid DPS or adjusted DPS Summoner comes out on top of Red Mage.


Edit: Also, in more general terms, the "X is relatively more complicated to play and therefore should do more DPS" is really an archaic design philosophy. To start: in no modern MMO is any spec "complex." There are just not enough buttons to justify such a stance. The game is more diverse and enjoyable if every spec is competitive, and not because spec X has a few more oGCDs to weave.

[SendohJin]

Red Mage does not do more damage than Summoner.

that's what this topic is suggesting.

How would we differentiate the classes? Easy make every exact class have the exact theoretical dps limit.

[CorbinDallas]

Red Mage does not do more damage than Summoner.


https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statistics/29#dataset=99


I've chosen the 99th percentile to eliminate the discrepancies between player skill levels. Whether it is raid DPS or adjusted DPS Summoner comes out on top of Red Mage.


Edit: Also, in more general terms, the "X is relatively more complicated to play and therefore should do more DPS" is really an archaic design philosophy. To start: in no modern MMO is any spec "complex." There are just not enough buttons to justify such a stance. The game is more diverse and enjoyable if every spec is competitive, and not because spec X has a few more oGCDs to weave.

I never said it did, I'm talking in context of the OP's suggestion.