So, can we just ban damage meters already.

[MrKusakabe]

You get "new player in the party" bonus rewards for anything you run.

Does not change my stance at all. Being "new" and being a slacker are two different things, mate. I had this just yesterday in LoL. An ADC "was new, do not flame him" whilst merely saying to right-click on the enemy. That was "toxic" of me apparently already. While LoL is a dumpster fire of historical measurements and can't be taken serious for any kind of valuable social interaction, this game has tools - votekicks and GMs. I lose my cool that moment you even dare to use this "argument" for your slacking. The same to White Knights, especially with their friends. (I told you the story of the #8-emnity Gun Breaker that "was learning" in Garuda Hard).


The game is pure fun to me and a leisure time activity. When I am in a dungeon, I am usually kinda mellow, especially as Red Mage, because I just freakin love every aspect of that profession. It makes me happy to be RDM, simply put. But you can get my bloodpressure high when someone "is new" and presses one button or runs into AoE circles. The toxicity, ironically, comes from the White Knights and pseudo-newbies - not from the people calling those out for their lack of teamwork and contribution.


To use the same analogy from my workday in a grocery store: The same "you are paid for helping me" people act like I have to put the items in their cart and drive them to their home and stock them in their fridge and and wipe your @$§! afterwards, too... No. Reality check: It merely means I offer goods in self-service, which are present on the shelves. Not more. If I am in a dungeon with you, I am here to be your Scholar or Red Mage. Not your magical mentor level-skip cheatcode instantwin buttler that has to pull 150% of your weight so my own time is not wasted in several wipes. This unspoken "Hah, he will carry me because he wants the bonus" attitude made me quit my Scholar duty often before. I happily get you stuck in a dungeon for a lesson of how to treat your teammates / party members. Unlike you, I can afford to leave the dungeon as completed it 50x before. You, as ungrateful newbie however,...

When you are new in a dungeon and you slack, you want others to pull more weight so you can have an easier life and get the same reward. It's a logical reflex that you get rid off parasites, no?

Also, my signature needs an alpha channel, but imgur hates PNGs with transparency for some reason, making those quotes ugly.....

[Alteriius]

This issue is clearly exaggerated. I've neither seen nor heard of any rampant harassment from parsers on Crystal. I'd wager OP is the bigger issue, given they refuse to communicate something as simple as being new.

[Komarimono]

Saying that someone sucks is useless. Explaining the fight and calling out what to use is actually helpful. If the person still isn't getting it then what does telling them they suck accomplish? It makes them feel bad and that's about it; is that what you're going for?

After spending 52 minutes in a dungeon, I had every right to tell that healer they really need to improve on paying attention to their surroundings and to better in depth research their job.

Those wipes cost ME money. Them failing to understand mechanics, even when explained in in depth detail wastes MY time and everyone else's.

They should feel bad about that, anyone should feel bad and regret for being a poor player, especially when people took the time to try and explain and they still couldn't improve. The only reason I stayed was because they needed it for MSQ, that was it. But once everything was done, I made sure they understood that next time they should research the dungeon, actually upgrade their gear and to pay attention.

This is a team based game, if can't work with a team, story or not, honestly work on getting better.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

I guess this also would be a bad time to mention that, given the fact that healer DPS is quite low at this lvl compounded by them not having most of their kit available yet and these dungeons ramping up damage considerably, which means they have to spend many of their GCD healing and that unless they took ages to raise OP, OP's DPS wouldn't have that much of a decline, OP's subpar performance wasn't derived mostly from the death and healer DPS in those dungeons is pretty low to begin with.

[Rivxkobe]

You get "new player in the party" bonus rewards for anything you run.

False. And even if you did being "new" and "not trying"/"being carried"/"not doing your job" are completely different things.

False.

There's a large difference between "do you mind using aoe spells for groups?" and "You are so bad, your dps is so low that you should just unsub"

I never said telling someone they are bad, or that they should unsub, isn't harassment. It is. But telling someone they aren't doing enough damage, or to do something, or to pull their weight because you don't want to carry them are not.

How about instead of twisting words or saying I said something I never did you actually discuss my point or the points being made by others in this thread?

[Fynlar]

If you (as a DPS) are doing damage so poor that the healer is outdamaging you, a "damage meter" is not even necessary for anyone to tell that you're doing poorly. It will be plain as day just by seeing your rotation.

Even if it were possible to ban them (it isn't), the actual problem (your performance) would still not be addressed.

[Vidu]

This is mostly just crap you've made up, and you act like it justifies harassment. Honestly, so what if the new player didn't ask for help; he may not have even wanted it. That's a not a valid point. And honestly, if the content is still EASILY clearable, who cares if they're under-performing? Again, just another flimsy justification for harassing people.

You say it's not right to harass people, but in the same breath throw all these flimsy rationalizations trying to fault the new player for the crappy way many of them are treated. It's dumb.

If a new played doesnt want help, I'll expect them to contribute to the teams effort in a reasonable manner, yes.
So yes, I do care if someone is under-performing even in easly cleared content because hes doing so on the back of the other party-members in said content and thats not okay with me. Not in a team based game like this. Not even if you dont care about the team based aspect of it because you only care about the story - you bought the whole package and have to deal with the whole package, including the team aspect. And that means to respect your team members by making sure to perform appropriatly to your level, aswell as communicating with them.
I'm not faulting the new player in general, I'm faulting the new player who has a mindset like I described - "I'm new, only care about story, I wont talk to you and you dont pay my sub!"
That player still shouldnt get harrassed and you should report any harrassment and the GMs will deal with it.

But at the same time the underlying issue of under-performing might have a true core, even if its presented in a bad and bannable way and it wouldnt be such a bad idea to work on such an underlying core of bad performance and bad attitude to prevent future problems.

You know... there is a crosswalk near my home and you obviously would expect cars to stop so a pedestrian can cross the street safely. Once in a while a car doesnt stop and after I was nearly run over once (sadly I was so confused that I didnt took down the plate or else I would have reported it) I make extra sure to signal that I want to cross and wait for the cars to stop before stepping on the street. I'm trying to do everything I can on my part to make sure I can cross this street safely - even though I shouldnt have to be extra careful and probably dont have to be in 90% of the cases.
But my point is: I rather go that little extra mile there than deal with any bad aftermath - specially if the extra mile is something simple as waiting for 5 seconds at a cross walk or saying "Hey, I'm new and would welcome any help!" in a chat. Being humble rarely hurts and often benefits, thats all I'm saying.

[Hyperia]

When I see somebody struggling with their job, I politely ask them if they would like some advice as I noticed they may be missing out on all that their job can do. If they say no, I respect their decision and finish the dungeon. If they do want help, I’ll give some quick advice and then take time at the end of the dungeon to go more in-depth.

We need to help all of those we can and accept that we can not save everybody.

[Saintly]

Since this topic have been discussed time and again, ill say what i said before.

I'm positive most people would have no problem if SE disabled 3rd party parsing in normal/hard content and instead added an official parser for EX/Ults.
That way casual players can enjoy/complete the story without harassment and so can more HC players.

[Cylla]

Sometimes you don't even need a meter to tell you that something off in a group. There are some people (very few) who actually use judgement over meters.

However, doesn't give anyone the right to harass another player just because a run going slower than normal or their rotation not up to snuff with said person doing the complaining.
If they say it or not, harassment is harassment, and you can report. Even try vote kick the person who being ugly.

The best you can do really.