So, can we just ban damage meters already.

[Arthrun]

lol, I hate being frustrated. If a game frustrates me, I just zone out and stop playing. While I don't mind mild difficulty, I shouldn't be getting frustrated and angry at a video game, it's just a game. I play games to have fun, being frustrated is not fun. When I get to that point and it is just too difficult, I just quit because I am no longer having fun.

Everyone has different levels of frustration they are willing to tolerate within a game. I believe Yoshi P understands the data that he has of where to place the different levels of frustration. Ultimate are few and far between because there is only a small % wiling to do them, Savage has a larger %, Extremes have even larger % and normal or easy has the largest % of players willing to do them.

My personal level of frustration I am willing to tolerate is at savage level. I do not have a desire to go higher than that. probably a reason I never could get into darksouls type games. just a level of frustration I do not want to bother with. I have a good friend I enjoy playing and hanging out with who basically does nothing but craft but so awesome to hang out with. refuses to do normal eden with me as the main tank because they find that content a bit too stressful to them.

[AphraelAmarantha]

Everyone has different levels of frustration they are willing to tolerate within a game. I believe Yoshi P understands the data that he has of where to place the different levels of frustration. Ultimate are few and far between because there is only a small % wiling to do them, Savage has a larger %, Extremes have even larger % and normal or easy has the largest % of players willing to do them.

My personal level of frustration I am willing to tolerate is at savage level. I do not have a desire to go higher than that. probably a reason I never could get into darksouls type games. just a level of frustration I do not want to bother with. I have a good friend I enjoy playing and hanging out with who basically does nothing but craft but so awesome to hang out with. refuses to do normal eden with me as the main tank because they find that content a bit too stressful to them.

Agreed! My frustration tolerance is very low, I would say Cidoulfus in Orbonne Monastery is my limit before i just tune out lol. Or Titannia Normal, that one is annoying when you get to the add stage.

[Rolder50]

Everyone has different levels of frustration they are willing to tolerate within a game. I believe Yoshi P understands the data that he has of where to place the different levels of frustration. Ultimate are few and far between because there is only a small % wiling to do them, Savage has a larger %, Extremes have even larger % and normal or easy has the largest % of players willing to do them.

My personal level of frustration I am willing to tolerate is at savage level. I do not have a desire to go higher than that. probably a reason I never could get into darksouls type games. just a level of frustration I do not want to bother with. I have a good friend I enjoy playing and hanging out with who basically does nothing but craft but so awesome to hang out with. refuses to do normal eden with me as the main tank because they find that content a bit too stressful to them.

I can agree with the Savage assessment, but for a different reason. I personally get easily annoyed by other people messing up mechanics. Especially when it's for dumb reasons like uptime greed. Now if they had some ultimate level solo content? Sign me the heck up.

[Liam_Harper]

I going to disagree with you. The main problem with the current triple AAA industry is trying to make games for everyone instead of certain demographic and adapt the budgets to realistic numbers. The bigger FFXIV the worst is going to get.

I'm curious, since this was upvoted I'm assuming players don't want a gradual difficulty curve or "easy to play, hard to master" classes. Since ff14 is marketed towards a casual playerbase foremost, being a theme park story-driven game at heart, if they chose to focus on a single demographic, they'd choose casual.

Does this mean the popular opinion is to delete EX, Savage and Ultimate entirely, make high skill cap classes like Ninja simple and focus entirely on the casual player? Genuine question, just unsure what you're disagreeing on specifically.

[Driavna]

I'm curious, since this was upvoted I'm assuming players don't want a gradual difficulty curve or "easy to play, hard to master" classes. Since ff14 is marketed towards a casual playerbase foremost, being a theme park story-driven game at heart, if they chose to focus on a single demographic, they'd choose casual.

Does this mean the popular opinion is to delete EX, Savage and Ultimate entirely, make high skill cap classes like Ninja simple and focus entirely on the casual player? Genuine question, just unsure what you're disagreeing on specifically.

Going to be blunt: casual does not equal to "ultra-easy mode" and/or lack of complexity (and no, not everything needs to be savage/ultimate). FFXIV at launch was a casual game regarding the time required but generally speaking, was more difficult/interesting (and I don't mean only raid content). Since then SE has been lowering the bar with no results (right now we have a topic about people lowering their ilvl to avoid certain content) outside annoying current players (in particular healers and probably tanks too). From my point of view, SE is following Blizzard footsteps with FFXIV.

I will also confess that my disagreement with you was mainly about Wildstar, but I just forgot to edit my post and add the extra information. Making it short Wildstar failed because of a rushed launch with bad performance, a lot of bugs and the game tried to pander to many playstyles (yep, only raids were aimed to hardcore). At launch, there wasn't enough content for anyone (plus the available one was buggy).

If instead of pandering to everyone Carbine decided to focus on one demographic and keep a realistic budget the game will have been probably alive today. You don't need millions of players to be successful and profitable.

Before finishing I have one question for you: why adapt FFXIV for solo players that only want to enjoy the story and do not want to bother learning the basics when SE can release another single-player FF title?

Edit: Once again I forgot about something! Ninja was not a hard class to play but after ShB became more awkward. Example: bushin has to be paired with trick attack but you are also required to use all your heavy hitters with includes ninjutsu that is not cloned by bushin and will delay your next weaponskill.

[FF16Necromancer]

At least in low level story dungeons. It's getting old.

I've been doing the main story as a healer, to avoid queue's, and I can think of at least 5 times off the top of my head where 1 DPS started harassing a sprout DPS over the dumb meter. These are like 40's normal story dungeons; never had any issues clearing them. It's stupid, and I actually want to defend the newbie, but I play on PS4 so it's almost impossible to actually converse in chat AND do your job. I usually just give the new player a commendation at the end, since it might make them feel better about it.

Of course, since I'm a diva, the last straw before I came here to whine on the forums about it was when it happened to me. I decided to queue as a Samurai for my first run of a story dungeon, and at the first boss I died to a mechanic. Unfortunate, but hey, that's why everyone gets a bonus for running with my newbie ass. Of course after the fight, right on queue, the other DPS goes off when his meter tells him I did less DPS than the healer; apparently he was so focused on the meter he didn't realize I died. Actually explaining it to him in chat wasn't an option (again, PS4), so I basically got to listen to crap about how I must've bought my character right up until the next boss, where my damage was fine; which eventually shut him up.

Anyways, garbage communities and things like damage meters just don't mix well. I understand them for personal use and progression stuff, but any mention of your dumb little meters in a random MSQ dungeon should be bannable.

I have not seen what you have said in low level story dungeons so really I don't think this is a huge issue.

[KeshLives]

I have not seen what you have said in low level story dungeons so really I don't think this is a huge issue.

I would agree. In the last two months I have not seen a DPS remark or raging or a ragequit of any kind in lower (<=60) group content. Only a few wipes, and on those, we just got up again and did it again, with a comment or two about what the gimmick or trick is on that fight. (No wipes seen on 'just dodge' fights. Had to be something special like Doom, or full raid wipes if not in the bubble, etc.

Also, if I hear a mention of meters on normal or hard content, I'll definitely report that. Leave that crap in the other MMOs, not here. If you're such a tryhard that you 'need' meters on normal or hard content, maybe you should go back to wherever you were, if you need that kind of validation at low difficulty.

If you want it on savage/extreme/ultimate, fine. I won't be going there anyway.

[Ammokkx]

it took titanman 2 bumps on 2 separate accounts, but my diddly damn he finally did get this necro'd again

Please. For the love of god. Report his accounts and let these threads stay buried.

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

FFXIV at launch was a casual game regarding the time required but generally speaking, was more difficult/interesting (and I don't mean only raid content). Since then SE has been lowering the bar with no results

I'm sorry, but that is just not true. Same thing as Classic Wow, in fact. Everyone claimed it was much harder than Normal WoW, while you got people running the latest raids naked two weeks after their release.

Bahamut is much, much easier than normal Eden. The only difficulty back then was servers at the other end of the world, and people being simply bad, both at playing their classes, and at doing mechanics.

The difficulty actually almost always went upwards, and right now, the game is not easy, the playerbase is just good. "gnngnn, but the dude I ran into in E11N last night", yes. There are bad players. That doesn't change the fact E11N is harder than Phenix, for example.

And your rant about ninja follows the same path. Actually, ShB Ninja is much less awkward that it once was, simply because of mudras, but yes, the burst window requires a lot of input. But it isn' t a bad thing at all, it only caters to people that like those sort of classes.

[Ammokkx]

I'm sorry, but that is just not true. Same thing as Classic Wow, in fact. Everyone claimed it was much harder than Normal WoW, while you got people running the latest raids naked two weeks after their release.

Bahamut is much, much easier than normal Eden. The only difficulty back then was servers at the other end of the world, and people being simply bad, both at playing their classes, and at doing mechanics.

The difficulty actually almost always went upwards, and right now, the game is not easy, the playerbase is just good. "gnngnn, but the dude I ran into in E11N last night", yes. There are bad players. That doesn't change the fact E11N is harder than Phenix, for example.

And your rant about ninja follows the same path. Actually, ShB Ninja is much less awkward that it once was, simply because of mudras, but yes, the burst window requires a lot of input. But it isn' t a bad thing at all, it only caters to people that like those sort of classes.

Ahem. I repeat myself.

it took titanman 2 bumps on 2 separate accounts, but my diddly damn he finally did get this necro'd again

Please. For the love of god. Report his accounts and let these threads stay buried.