I DON'T like Stormblood RDM

[Marianno]

What am I saying that’s wrong/untrue? RDM has utility, the chances of RDM being able to share that utility is likely to never happen, and REZ is considered utility whether we like or not, by SE’s standards and is a matter of debate among other things. BLM has nothing too give to the party except damage. Why would you want too take that away from the job? What good will it be? RDM does deserve potency buffs but hoping for anything super significant I feel like is bad in a way. Do not misunderstand me, I want RDM to get the potency buffs it needs to be competitive but at the rate SE is going, things will not be super significant in my opinion. I think SE should have done more for RDM at the start of ShB but that didn’t happen. Tearing down BLM does not solve the problem. Again, it’s highly likely that RDM will never be able to give up or shed its utility so it will have to deal with being lower than BLM on the DPS totem pole. I don’t like that REZ is counted as utility and it should not be such a high tax...but it is.

[Marianno]

Give me your utility and we’ll call it even. This isn’t about smelling the dominance of anything. You want bigger numbers, give me your utility. As I stated before and I’ll say it again. This started when SE thought it was a good idea to give DPS jobs utility buffs to change how groups coordinate. Maybe making it so the buffs only affect the job who applies the buff and adjusting numbers from there.

[Wayfinder3]

Give me your utility and we’ll call it even. This isn’t about smelling the dominance of anything. You want bigger numbers, give me your utility. As I stated before and I’ll say it again. This started when SE thought it was a good idea to give DPS jobs utility buffs to change how groups coordinate. Maybe making it so the buffs only affect the job who applies the buff and adjusting numbers from there.

if you honestly believe the caster dps disparity right now is filled by Raises, Embolden, and Vercure or the Devotion. idk what to tell you. You value the utility way higher than the numbers point to. BLM is FAR stronger than RDM and SMN and, thats including the utility besides Raise and vercure. again BLM has 41% of all eden savage Titan caster clears while RDM has 20%. is that fair?

[Marianno]

No it isn’t fair but all I am trying too say is that whether we like or not SE consider those too be utility. Though I cannot presume too know how they are thinking. The thinking behind what they consider utility and the tax is clearly not correct by any standard. It is their thinking that things are okay as RDM was not mentioned in this past live letter. RDM needs too be brought up with potency buffs and maybe change how the mana accumulation works but not at the expense of another job. Not sure if I am expressing what I want too say correctly. But that is the gist of it.

[CrashofZenki]

Just tl;dr'ed the core of everything that has been said. No strawman here, just simplifying, a summary if you will.

[Kabooa]

Just tl;dr'ed the core of everything that has been said. No strawman here, just simplifying, a summary if you will.

Let me help you. I'll use small words.

"IF BLACK MAGE IS 12k, THEN SO IS NINJA."

"IF NINJA GIVES 3% MORE RDPS, IT GIVES THE BLACK MAGE 6%"

"BLACK MAGE RDPS: 12,000"

"NINJA RDPS: 12,720"

Needs tuning, but if you took more than a minute to digest, that's the outcome you should have come to.

[CrashofZenki]

Let me help you. I'll use small words.

"IF BLACK MAGE IS 12k, THEN SO IS NINJA."

"IF NINJA GIVES 3% MORE RDPS, IT GIVES THE BLACK MAGE 6%"

"BLACK MAGE RDPS: 12,000"

"NINJA RDPS: 12,720"

Needs tuning, but if you took more than a minute to digest, that's the outcome you should have come to.

Ah, then I apolegize for miss-reading. The end result does seem fair if thats how they do it. Should satisfy everyone involved.

And this is exactly the point I have been trying to get accross for god knows how long. the small words you just wrote.
But apparently that has been shot down so much by so many. Especially SAM BLM and MNK mains.

[Kabooa]

Ah, then I apolegize for miss-reading. The end result does seem fair if thats how they do it. Should satisfy everyone involved.

And this is exactly the point I have been trying to get accross for god knows how long. the small words you just wrote.
But apparently that has been shot down so much by so many. Especially SAM BLM and MNK mains.

Our current system really doesn't support it, which is why there's a whole blurb of set up.

In our current system, to maintain that sort of parity means the RDPS bringers are severely lower on PDPS (and suffer in other parts of the game) or our PDPS aren't bringing anything worthwhile (And thus you could just use 4 RDPS and get a greater result)

That's my opinion at least. I think we need some structural change to really have that be an equitable set up, I dont' claim to speak for the others.

[CrashofZenki]

How about.. Utility buff scales with how many is in the party? Solo = full utility, Light Party = 1/4th effect each, Full Party = 1/8th effect each.

and on top of this... exceeding 2 utility DPS will give a small tax
3 utility DPS per party will put a 2/3th on total utility given to party
4 utility DPS per party giving 1/3th of total utility given to party

But keep utility DPS very close to non-utility DPS.

Would ease up the pDPS gap between no utility and utility DPS.
Maintain openings to non-utility classes while not bringing down utility DPS to the point where they dont matter.

[Kabooa]

I do think that could do well if tuned right, but then it's a matter of perception.

"Rested XP bonus" vs "XP Death Penalty", ya know?

The two would probably require the same amount of work tuning wise, but one of them creates a negative "We don't want this" compared to a "We do want this" while achieving the same result.