People wanting a support class. Why?

[Nora_of_Mira]

mostly because hunt hunting buffs aren’t that great, plus you got to stop what you’re doing and play a song.

[unrelated to FFxiv now]

negating hearing and wind effects arent great? no stamina loss isnt great? Also, if your HH user was standing off to the side to play songs, they're playing it wrong.

[gman1311]

What did you think RDM was in 11, only reason it was so good was on what subjob you used.

Never played ff11.

[Duskane]

Then I play games like Monster Hunter and see very few people actually role the Hunting Horn. The support job of that game. I always feel like it's one of those things where it's something people think they want but won't actually enjoy it when they get it; because it won't turn out to be their vision of it.

Monster hunter Is a very different game though as there is no roles
HH has support aspect but it's not a support role
Plus MH "hardcore" community is solo TA's so no surprise why HH is least popular choice

Don't be a corner horner no different to a red mage that only uses vercure and raise

[Deusteele]

Wow, haven't seen this thread topic in a long time. /yawn

"Jack of all trades, master of none" should be read as "Utterly Worthless, pointless to bring". We've had this conversation like 5 years ago. I can look into my post history and see the exact same arguments, the exact same counter-arguments.

In short. The answer is No.

[JunseiKei]

Then I play games like Monster Hunter and see very few people actually role the Hunting Horn. The support job of that game. I always feel like it's one of those things where it's something people think they want but won't actually enjoy it when they get it; because it won't turn out to be their vision of it.

HH also follows quite a bit of the same logic as a hammer - needs very good understanding of how the monster will turn, keeping track of stagger thresholds and positioning needs to be on point. Then add in the requirement of knowing when you have enough recovery for playing songs in between attacks and not getting smacked in the face. The fact that a lot of HH users I do see are well away from the monster and dooting means they don't have a very firm grasp of the weapon to actually play it well. Like watching a charge blader never use guard points, dual swords never use demon dance, insect glaives that seem to want to stay in the air, bows that don't understand critical range, etc, etc, etc. They're effectively the healer that only heals and never touches a damage spell even as they stand there for a few GCDs. They'll mostly suffice, outside of ultimates and savages, but that doesn't mean they're good.

Someone who actually plays HH is like having someone that actually plays hammer - they stand out and make runs super smooth and fast with the sheer amount of staggers and buffs.

[Nyxn607]

I don't know if you ever played EQ (Everquest), but the bard class in that game a pure support. They would weave songs together for supportive buffs (running speed, dmg up, mana regen, hp regen, faster cast times, etc ..). They had some offensive songs just powerful enough to get by in solo grinds, but they shined in a group.

The closest things we have to an EQ bard in ffxiv is dancer atm, and it only buffs dmg and run speed technically.
Reasons why I want a pure Support:
- it fits my play style very well.
- there are no damage meters built into the game and I play on ps4, so my drive to be competitive as a dps job is pretty low.
- healing in ffxiv is meh at best, it is just another dps that happens to heal when you have bad tanks/dps.
- tanking in ffxiv is just boring to me
- I like making other people shine in my groups

[rachcouture]

The amount of negativity in this thread really baffles me.

There's nothing in this game that wouldn't allow for proper support roles. No, we don't need crowd control, but we can still use buffs/debuffs, off heals, and other support staples to give an edge. While some of that is spread across various jobs in limited capacity, building an entire job around it (what Bard, Dancer, and Red Mage should have been) is long overdue. Dancer comes close, but it's still not quite where it needs to be to be a full-on support class; Curing Waltz needs a buff, Shield Samba's CD is too long, and its needless proc-based attacks could be easily swapped for far more useful debuffs.

Damage? Just give them the same basic attacks healers have, and rescale numbers to reduce the burden on the lower count of DPS players per duty. It's not rocket science.

As for the dreaded "but then they'll be required!": guess what? That already happens in savage raids/EX trials. Some jobs are greatly favored, and others are unwanted. Adding a support role wouldn't change that.

Heaven forbid we add some complexity back and streamline DPS jobs by shifting support skills to the classes that should have them instead. With healers being an absolute gutted mess right now, players like me that prefer to aid the party instead of raw damage (which, for me, is incredibly bland) have very little in the way of viable alternative options.

[Miu-Tiiu]

*sighs...

I do miss the support side that Bards had.

It was so much fun and I'm like others who do feel the satisfaction of helping others pushing their numbers a bit higher. Oh well.... got to get use to what it became now.

[RoyalBeef]

I don't know if you ever played EQ (Everquest), but the bard class in that game a pure support. They would weave songs together for supportive buffs (running speed, dmg up, mana regen, hp regen, faster cast times, etc ..). They had some offensive songs just powerful enough to get by in solo grinds, but they shined in a group.

You're forgetting AoE- and Charmkiting. Effectively a high skill low ping bard was also the most efficient solo class, s an addition to being one of the most sought after classes for groups and raids ^^ Not even starting with utilities like Highsun, fading memories etc. By todays standards the class was just completely broken. Did you ever see a warrior who could not even solo single green cons complain about bards being OP? No one cared about balance, that's what made the game great nd the classes unique. That just wouldn't fly anymore in today's MMO enviroment.

[Miu-Tiiu]

A Bard's song is suppose to invigorate and motivate others who hears it to fight harder. That was the whole point behind their job story quests, right?

So...

Feels like we're humming to ourselves and others are going, "What?! We can't hear you!"