Is it me or has the community gotten worse...

[Seryne]

This games community has always had a veneer of fake positivity and kindness up until some sort of perceived slight. You can say anything in the least confrontational way and people will still take it wrong and flip out on you or even report you now. It's why I gave up mentoring and talking to people in DF for the most part since I'm tired of people freaking out at me over the smallest things. It's just really not worth it anymore.

[Melichoir]

Let me get this straight:

1. You let bad behavior "roll off your back" without addressing it.
2. You mock and insult players who report bad behavior.
3. You claim that you're not encouraging bad behavior.

1) and 2) don't add up to 3) here. Try again.

What you fail to get is what you define as what should be reported and what I define differ. I dont care if someone is a jerk in a one off. You do. You see that behavior as "It needs to be corrected," where I see it as "Guys a jerk. Oh well, thats his problem."

Of the players I do 'mock', it's the ones who cant handle any level of negativity. Even the mere hint of "You suck" is to much for their sensibilities. Why spend minutes or even hours getting so angry and upset and pissed at what some stranger who spent 4 seconds to type out "You suck" or "Another Carried DPS" or whatever. What is being accomplished by filing that report? Are you doing this for the sake of the community and correcting bad behavior or for your own personal feelings? Are you really 'correcting' the issue or just emotionally satisfying yourself? And to be clear, Im not mocking people for reporting targetted harassment or severely reprehensible language (harsh racial/identity slurs and the like). That stuff should be addressed by a GM. That is worth addressing as a community but it requires that we understand that there is nuance and that a targetted harassment or racial slurs (as is the go to talking point when discussing Toxicity) and someone telling you to "git gud" or "you suck". Saying that both are just as bad and require the same means to address it is a terrible idea to me. Part of fixing this issue, to me, requires people 'fix' themselves. Words become a lot less scary and powerful if we dont let them hold sway over us.

There's nuance to my position. I feel youre just failing to acknowledge it, either through naivety or purposefully being obtuse. As I said, Im not encouraging bad behavior in the slightest. Im dealing with an issue in my way, and think that this way to approach a problem is far more ideal and better for the community than your way. Thats all there is to it. If you dont like it, well ok. Then you do you. Ill still continue to think that at best your way is silly, and at worst itll lead to problems, but thats how it is.

[RareItems]

The forums used to be a good resource for information, but now it's just a place where bored mentors and raiders check to flex their elitism lol. Reading this thread kinda proves they're the problem. It's not the Roleplayers, The PS4 Players, the New Players, The Crafters, The Gatherers, The Housing Enthusiasts or the people who like to just mod their outfits. Nope, its always been and forever will be the Raiders and Mentors.

Not saying All Raiders and Mentors are Elitist and Toxic. Just most if not all of the Toxic/Elitist ppl on the game and on this forums are Raiders and Mentors.

[Baalfrog]

The forums used to be a good resource for information, but now it's just a place where bored mentors and raiders check to flex their elitism lol. Reading this thread kinda proves they're the problem. It's not the Roleplayers, The PS4 Players, the New Players, The Crafters, The Gatherers, The Housing Enthusiasts or the people who like to just mod their outfits. Nope, its always been and forever will be the Raiders and Mentors.

Not saying All Raiders and Mentors are Elitist and Toxic. Just most if not all of the Toxic/Elitist ppl on the game and on this forums are Raiders and Mentors.

Aren't you being toxic here, pointing fingers and being all like everyone but ME, and hating others because they like something else? #notallraiders

[Vaunhause]

The forums used to be a good resource for information, but now it's just a place where bored mentors and raiders check to flex their elitism lol. Reading this thread kinda proves they're the problem. It's not the Roleplayers, The PS4 Players, the New Players, The Crafters, The Gatherers, The Housing Enthusiasts or the people who like to just mod their outfits. Nope, its always been and forever will be the Raiders and Mentors.

Not saying All Raiders and Mentors are Elitist and Toxic. Just most if not all of the Toxic/Elitist ppl on the game and on this forums are Raiders and Mentors.

My savage raiding experience has been more pleasant than me word for word asking people in roulettes if they "want tips on how to play their class", and instead get passive aggressive responses for wanting to help. Of course, if they say no, I wont say nothin'.

Not a mentor, btw. Just a casual savage raider that's progging E4S atm.

Sure, this happened maybe to just me. Maybe I'm missing all of the people you're talking about. But idk, dude. I think theres bad apples all around. Not just Savage raiders and mentors. But casual players too. And as far as majorities go, theres FAR less mentors and savage raiders than there are just normal people, who mayhap don't know how to play their class well.

But, y'know. God forbid you reach out a hand, else they might bite. Which, doesn't happen so often, but it does happen.

Things are so much more than just black and white than what you are laying them out to be, and if you consider it otherwise after being told, you are just in denial. Sorry.

[plamya]

Great community btw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kH8tLmG0TRY

[kartana]

There is more elitism I would say. Or maybe I was just lucky all the years before.

[Connor]

I find it hard to believe that anyone has been actually banned or punished for giving purely neutral advice to another party member. And I find it just as hard to believe that people are going into duty finder and consistently coming across unpleasant or nasty people.

As for the rest should someone really need to justify feeling upset or offended? I’m not sure there’s much to be had in trying to rationalise an irrational emotion. If we’re going to argue that people need ‘legitimate reason’ to be upset, surely we also have to argue that people should have ‘legitimate reason’ to be angry about it? People will feel the way they do regardless of how they think it’s going to be perceived by others, especially online where they aren’t subject to the same rules they would be in the ‘real world’ due to things like enforceability (they can’t survey the chat logs of of the entire game all at the same time to see if someone’s trolling). I think of everyone around me on an MMO as characters rather than representations of the player’s itself and identity, and ultimately I think it’s easy to see why people do the things they do from this perspective. I think this kind of perspective is something that developers naturally through extended play and can be quite implicit. I feel like maybe other players feel this way too, maybe without even realising it. When people are ‘trolling’, they’re doing it as whichever character they’ve taken themselves to being at that time, and not as one human being to another. I know there’s always the idea that people are inherently selfish and mean, but there’s plenty of evidence to the contrary (though that’s a different discussion entirely lol).

Basically what I’m saying is I think when people are ‘mean’ online it’s because they’re starting to develop a disconnect between the human behind the screen and the characters themselves. I’m not trying to justify it, because ultimately you should always be aware that the people around you are - well - people, and they’re going to have their own feelings about your actions regardless of what you think they should feel. No amount of telling people to get thicker skin will stop that, because you can’t just change a person’s entire mindset and perception of things with a single sentence (though wouldn’t that be nice lol).

In terms of reporting I’m not sure the GM’s are so callous as to ban everyone who was ever reported regardless of the circumstances. If you haven’t done anything wrong, I can’t see them just banning people. And if you have done something wrong, I’m sure (I hope at least) that the GM’s would take the time to explain the circumstances that lead to that decision and maybe how to avoid it in future

Disclaimer All statements are made based purely on my own opinions and perceptions of things and as such I do not endorse it as being representative of the community at the large or anyone other than myself. I am not suggesting that any of these statements are inherently ‘true’ beyond my own perception of them.

Additionally is it just me or have the word ‘toxic’ lost all its meaning? I used to think of something powerfully corrosive and dangerous to the wellbeing of those around it. But I’ve seen it so much recently now I just think of that Britney Spears song...

[Deceptus]

Additionally is it just me or have the word ‘toxic’ lost all its meaning? I used to think of something powerfully corrosive and dangerous to the wellbeing of those around it. But I’ve seen it so much recently now I just think of that Britney Spears song...

It's just become an attack on people you disagree with.