Something doesn't add up regarding the connection between Amdapor and Norvrandt...

[Ouen]

In Live Letter LLIII, this answer was given:

Q17:
In the Eorzea Encyclopedia II it mentions that the statues found within Amdapor were made in the image of transcendent beings from yet another plane. Was this referring to the Sin Eaters from the First?

A17:
In the sense of "if you look back at the Lore book, you notice certain things," we did this intentionally.

Amdapor was founded around year 300 of the Fifth Astral Era, with the War of the Magi culminating in 1510 before the Sixth Umbral Era/Calamity of Water (indeterminate length). This was followed by the Sixth Astral Era, lasting close to sixteen centuries, which led up to the events of Dalamud's fall; the Seventh Umbral Era we're all familiar with.

Taking all this into account, the Ancient City was founded approximately 2,780 years ago (give or take a few with the Sixth Astral Era, the length of which is unclear) if I'm doing the math right. As we learn in Shadowbringers, time flows differently on the First than on the Source. We experience it as being greatly accelerated, with only a few days of comatose scions on the Source aging their spirits several years on the First.

The Flood of Light happened a century ago on the First, which means that with a reference point on the Source, Sin Eaters have only been around for perhaps a few weeks or months, provided the accelerated flow of time remained consistent during this period through the events of Shadowbringers. (Can time flow slower on the first? I don't remember if that was confirmed.)

Yoshi-P's answer along with that line from Encyclopedia Eorzea implies that the Amdapori built their Guardians in the image of Sin Eaters in order to protect themselves from the subjugation of Mhach fifteen hundred years ago. However, it seems as though Sin Eaters have only existed for weeks, let alone for anywhere between 1,500 to 2,800 years Source-time. It stands to reason that the Amdapori were mingling with things that had yet to exist for several tens, or perhaps even hundreds of thousands of years on the First.

Now, as I said, I'm not sure if time on the First can progress slower relative to its passing on the Source, but prior to our arrival, time was flowing at an accelerated rate to what we experience, which caused the scions to age rapidly. As the Exarch beckons us, it slows to a period of "near-equivalence." Given that time was accelerated just before we arrived, it stands to reason that the passage of time during the age since the Flood of Light happened was also accelerated, or at the very least, intuition tells us it's unlikely for the flow of time to have fluctuated so wildly in the span of a mere century that it went from source-days corresponding to first-years, to grinding to a halt with source-millennia being a first-century, all coincidentally in time for us to arrive moments before the Rejoining of the First to the Source.

(continued below)

[Ouen]

There's not much hand-waving in the lore of XIV, with the story having very few, if any, plot holes or inconsistencies that I'm aware of, so I am hesitant to conclude "well, time just conveniently flowed in such a way that Amdapor's founding and the Flood of Light coincided perfectly, then First-time virtually froze for 1,500 years, allowing for the events of the present to happen before the First can be rejoined. EVEN IF we assume this is the case, there's still something very, very strange going on.

Let's assume both events played out just right: Square waves their hands and everything magically happens to line up. At the very moment that Amdapor peers into/visits the first, they happen to find Sin Eaters existing in this minuscule window of time. They say "Wow these things are SICK, let's use them as inspiration," they go home and that's the extent of their inter-dimensional adventures.

If Sin Eaters really are the basis upon which the guardians were built, it indicates one of two possibilities that I can conceive of. Either the Amdapori had some means of traversing the rift between reflections, (possibly even being able to travel up and down the river of time, or at the bare minimum, were possessed of the ability to peer across and see other shards as they are in the present) or the Source was visited by Sin Eaters, which has been erased from the history books.

Both implications are extremely interesting, to say the least... If it's the former, why didn't they take the future Ironworks' technology or something else to ensure their sovereignty or victory in the War of the Magi? Were they searching for something else on the First? If it's the latter outcome, well... the story is about to become much more interesting.

[ObsidianFire]

This is my problem with the "Amdapori statues are based on sin eaters" logic too. The timing just doesn't add up unless the Amdapori could view the future or someone sent a sin eater way back in time.

Also... you can get around the 3k character limit by editing your initial post and adding in the rest of it.

[Ouen]

Oh, that's very helpful Thank you!

[Crushnight]

The best explanation i can come up with without future sight or the time shenanigans between shards is perhaps the Amdapori experimented on themselves or prisoners or beasts on what would happen if you infuse too much light into a being, and watching the slaughter/carnage that would follow, then deside that making golums based on said monstrosities would be great additions to fighting against voidsent/mhach. Also can probably assume Ascian involvement with the war of the magi so could very well get info from them.

[JeanneOrnitier]

It's possible that the time difference between the Shards and Source is more dramatic than we thought and sometimes time can seem to flow backwards between them, though that's convoluted. A simpler explanation would probably be that someone in Amdapor had a vision of the future. Whatever the case, I recall Alphinaud mentioning at one point that he wanted to investigate it so I expect we'll see something mention it in-game even if it's not a major focus.

[MrThinker]

Whatever the case, I recall Alphinaud mentioning at one point that he wanted to investigate it so I expect we'll see something mention it in-game even if it's not a major focus.

To be more specific it is his dialogue after beating the first boss of the lvl79 dungeon if you take him as a Trust.

[TankHunter678]

Given the existence of Eden, one of the Guardian Forces the Ancients created for combating the calamity they faced based on the Akadaemia Anyder notes, on the First and that it may have been slumbering on the First ever since the Sundering on top of Eden being credited as being the Original Sin Eater it may have had some Sin Eaters in the immediate area around where it slept before the overflowing light woke it back up. This would mean that at any point in time an Ascian could have setup a vision for one of the Amdapori to let them peer through the barrier and see these Sin Eaters. The goal obviously being to give the Amdapori a means to take the fight to Mhachi and their voidsent. With open war being possible it sets the stage for the War of the Mages and the calamity it sparked to follow.

[geekgirl101]

We've also seen a similar fiend in the First that we've known for a long time in the Source - the Demon Wall. That rather surprised me to see one of those in the First, so I did some digging after reading this topic and reventured into Amdapor Keep and read up the dungeon information regarding the different segments of Amdapor.

Whilst inside the final dungeon a couple of things took my interest - Dark Wings, a regal lion which is identical to one of the Lightwardens we fought on the First, the Crystallum which is a regal looking chamber flooded with Light and filled with Light-based monsters that brings to mind Vauthry's palace in the sky, and what should we meet with at the end of the Crystallum? A powerful sin eater capable of summoning both Light and Dark lesser sin eaters.

Putting aside the recent activities of the Lambs of Dalamud that reawokened the monsters inside that had for centuries been sleeping in stone, what happened back in the ancient city of Amdapor bears a striking resemblance to events that were happening on the First. Wielders of powerful and forbidden magicks who could reshape the fabric of existance and saw themselves as gods, monsters born of dark aether that transformed other living beings and fauna into blood-thirsty monstrosities, and a catastrophe that followed that brought about the end of the Fifth Astral Era. This sounds like the works of Ascians creating the very same monstrosities that were resulting in the very same disaster as on the First only this was Dark-based instead of Light-based. They were doing exactly the same thing back then.

Which now makes me wonder, was Diabolos originally a Darkwarden?

[Atamis]

I don't think its a matter of Sin Eaters only existing on the first and then Amdapor copies them. I assume Sin Eaters are a natural phenomenon when anything gets too much light aether as are Voidsent when they lost all their aether. I interpreted it as Ampdapor looked into their magic ball, seen creatures of pure light aether and copied them. At some point afterward the flood happened from mass light aether and the rest is history. My question would be, are the Lightwardens always the same or were they particularly strong vitims caught by the flood (or in Titanias sake, something more powerful that slayed the previous)