Are FCs "guilds" or LSes "guilds"

[AnimaAnimus]

There are not true guilds in ffxiv because there really isn't a need for it. You can do everything, outside ultimate, with pick up groups and you barely have to leave your house to do it. That is the way ffxiv is specifically designed. This is an mmo that is more of a coop game than a true mmo. You only need to interact with others by clicking on join pt or join roulette. You don't need to even say hello or goodbye if you don't want to. You don't need to participate in any chat or depend on anyone for absolutely anything. Heck you cant even give constructive criticism without someone loosing their mind. So the best you can hope for is that the party will pull its weight.

I have an FC here on Sarg. I tried for a long long time to run it like a guild, I had a guild in ffxi that lasted from 2005ish to 2012 with the same core group of people and we were great friends and did a lot for and with each other. But here I couldn't get ppl to show up for raids, no one would wait for others to finish what they were doing to run roulettes together or do maps, no one was willing to help teach things, no one could show up on time for anything scheduled and then some would go berserk over not completing content. I eventually turned it into a solo FC then invited some rl friends who barely play anyway but when they do they at least have access to a house.

You don't need people cause you can just do whatever, whenever and that is not conducive to creating a tight nit group that rely on each other long enough to form any sort of relationship.

This is not a social game unless you go out of your way to make it that way. So coming to ffxiv and expecting any semblance of a guild they way it is in other games, or the way it was in the past, is going to do nothing but bring you disappointment. If you are looking for the true guild experience, my suggestion would be to look somewhere else, because its all but impossible here.

[Vivi_Bushido]

There are not true guilds in ffxiv because there really isn't a need for it. You can do everything, outside ultimate, with pick up groups and you barely have to leave your house to do it. That is the way ffxiv is specifically designed. This is an mmo that is more of a coop game than a true mmo. You only need to interact with others by clicking on join pt or join roulette. You don't need to even say hello or goodbye if you don't want to. You don't need to participate in any chat or depend on anyone for absolutely anything. Heck you cant even give constructive criticism without someone loosing their mind. So the best you can hope for is that the party will pull its weight.

I have an FC here on Sarg. I tried for a long long time to run it like a guild, I had a guild in ffxi that lasted from 2005ish to 2012 with the same core group of people and we were great friends and did a lot for and with each other. But here I couldn't get ppl to show up for raids, no one would wait for others to finish what they were doing to run roulettes together or do maps, no one was willing to help teach things, no one could show up on time for anything scheduled and then some would go berserk over not completing content. I eventually turned it into a solo FC then invited some rl friends who barely play anyway but when they do they at least have access to a house.

You don't need people cause you can just do whatever, whenever and that is not conducive to creating a tight nit group that rely on each other long enough to form any sort of relationship.

This is not a social game unless you go out of your way to make it that way. So coming to ffxiv and expecting any semblance of a guild they way it is in other games, or the way it was in the past, is going to do nothing but bring you disappointment. If you are looking for the true guild experience, my suggestion would be to look somewhere else, because its all but impossible here.

This sums up my experiences perfectly and if I were on your server you seem like someone I'd like to get behind. You said it best, this game isn't that social in the grand scheme. Things like Novice Network and statics create the illusion it is but it really isn't. To a certain degree I kind of blame Discord. Linkshells and FC chats were all the rage before Discord became a mandatory form of communication. Even joining an FC, you have to rely on discord for most guild updates or notices. Most in-game social networking is done through Discord, and personally I struggle to keep up with Discord chats when I have 30 servers with 10 channels apiece and I'm in the middle of a roulette.

Some reason, it's just really hard to get a new fresh FC off the ground these days. Recruiting isn't the hard part, it's convincing people to stay that is. I can't tell you how many FCs I have ran that I have given up on as the leader because the members would not be engaging and the very moment I say I am disbanding the FC, they all vulture to me asking for the house claiming they could revive it. Where were you prior to this decision? Half the time when someone logs in, they don't even say hello when you say hi to them. I feel most people join FCs with an agenda in mind such as using it for Heat of Battle or a private chambers and that's about it. Guilds are just really hard to get into. The really big ones are so big your voice is never really heard. You get drowned out and talked over. There are never any chances for leadership promotion opportunities because the spots are always filled. The small ones are so small and cliquey you feel like a misfit trying to fit into the clique that so far doesn't even have similar interests as you. And something both have in common, you join an FC really distasting the housing decoration and really wish someone would redecorate it but stay because you like the people so far.

[Eldevern]

...

+1

I noticed this too. When it was Teamspeak or Mumble, it was different but since Discord is released, FC chats ended to be silent, everything is going on Discord.

Many FCs have their own in-house statics that you can join, but that is not the primary purpose of an FC.

That's the theory, most FC I met since ARR beta had problems because of static matters.

[AnimaAnimus]

the very moment I say I am disbanding the FC, they all vulture to me asking for the house claiming they could revive it. Where were you prior to this decision?.

omg don't even get me started on this part. In ffxi we all had our roles, everyone pitched in and it ran like a well oiled machine. We each led different raids while keeping our 'help a newb' program going, we all recruited and things were very democratic. It worked wonderfully due to mutual respect. We all kept up our parts and we all put in effort both in battle and in our roles in the ls, no one needed to be carried, everyone got loot.

Here I tried to promote ppl to help me out. They didn't do....anything. No one helped recruit, everyone wanted to lead a raid and then just wouldn't, and getting them to chat was nearly impossible. Finally a couple years ago I was in the final stretch of uni and told ppl, I need help. I am in the library or studio til 2am and I cant be here as much. No one...not a single person stepped up. They just all wanted me to do it. One girl went as far as cussing me out on discord cause she wasn't progressing and she felt it was my fault. Even though she was notorious to sign up for primal farms or 8 mans and no show. She was in my fc for nearly a year and only showed up once. Her screeching in voice chat almost made my ears bleed. So I kicked and blisted her. (her bf sent me a tell later apologizing for her behavior, he was in the fc too).

But it was after no one stepped up that I just made an announcement, gave everyone a week notice and kicked them after. But that whole week people wanted the fc, cause they could do better, we could do great things if we just work together, yada yada yada. Its like Oh just piss off.

[Vivi_Bushido]

omg don't even get me started on this part. In ffxi we all had our roles, everyone pitched in and it ran like a well oiled machine. We each led different raids while keeping our 'help a newb' program going, we all recruited and things were very democratic. It worked wonderfully due to mutual respect. We all kept up our parts and we all put in effort both in battle and in our roles in the ls, no one needed to be carried, everyone got loot.

Here I tried to promote ppl to help me out. They didn't do....anything. No one helped recruit, everyone wanted to lead a raid and then just wouldn't, and getting them to chat was nearly impossible. Finally a couple years ago I was in the final stretch of uni and told ppl, I need help. I am in the library or studio til 2am and I cant be here as much. No one...not a single person stepped up. They just all wanted me to do it. One girl went as far as cussing me out on discord cause she wasn't progressing and she felt it was my fault. Even though she was notorious to sign up for primal farms or 8 mans and no show. She was in my fc for nearly a year and only showed up once. Her screeching in voice chat almost made my ears bleed. So I kicked and blisted her. (her bf sent me a tell later apologizing for her behavior, he was in the fc too).

But it was after no one stepped up that I just made an announcement, gave everyone a week notice and kicked them after. But that whole week people wanted the fc, cause they could do better, we could do great things if we just work together, yada yada yada. Its like Oh just piss off.

I kind of like this conversation and would like to hear more from you about it, would you mind if I contacted you in-game and chat a bit? Would give my discord here but don't really wanna throw that out publicly. xD

[AnimaAnimus]

I kind of like this conversation and would like to hear more from you about it, would you mind if I contacted you in-game and chat a bit? Would give my discord here but don't really wanna throw that out publicly. xD

Anytime, I am always happen to chat

[FunkYeahDragons]

I play with the friends I made raiding in Heavensward and Stormblood, fish, and wait for August 27th. I have an FC and three social Linkshells, but I usually turn on Netflix because there's not much talk going on. That's just kind of how the game is.

If you need a consistent schedule, a proper static raiding group is the way to go. The same 8 people every week, on nights you've all agreed on.

[YojimboM]

God forbid anyone put in any effort to socialize and figure out how to find a static.

Free Companies are "guilds", Linkshells are the equivalent of custom chat channels in other MMOs. The way you're looking at it is most definitely not the norm. It has nothing to do with "individualistic nature" (most of the people playing this game lean towards a more JP mentality to be entirely honest, not to mention "western culture" is all about following the crowd these days if you haven't realized), people just gravitate to social groups that do the same things that they do, like in real life.

You said you had an FC that hosts events and social things, so it's frankly a bit bizarre where that rant is coming from since there are a lot of really big FCs out there that do the same thing and they are definitely not hard to find. However, FCs are not statics or raid groups, they're guilds and "guild" doesn't mean everyone is attached at the hip and running all the content in any MMO, especially not savage or ultimate. They're simply organizations of people. Many FCs have their own in-house statics that you can join, but that is not the primary purpose of an FC. FCs are general-purpose unless they're specifically geared towards raiding or any other particular niche.

If you want to run endgame content or savage, find a static and get involved in the raiding community like everyone else that does it. It's not going to come to you.

[Colt47]

God forbid anyone put in any effort to socialize and figure out how to find a static.

...

If you want to run endgame content or savage, find a static and get involved in the raiding community like everyone else that does it. It's not going to come to you.

I'm actually making an organized playgroup and FYI if someone wants to use the word static one more time I'm going to take a giant salmon and slap them across the face several times because the term does little to inform of the amount of work required to get people comfortable working together, caught up on gear, and then breaking down the garbage barrier that PF has created from all the idiots running duty complete only and no one wanting to help late comers.

Also, thank you everyone who does go through the pains of doing so: you are making the game a better place.

You said you had an FC that hosts events and social things, so it's frankly a bit bizarre where that rant is coming from since there are a lot of really big FCs out there that do the same thing and they are definitely not hard to find. However, FCs are not statics or raid groups, they're guilds and "guild" doesn't mean everyone is attached at the hip and running all the content in any MMO, especially not savage or ultimate. They're simply organizations of people. Many FCs have their own in-house statics that you can join, but that is not the primary purpose of an FC. FCs are general-purpose unless they're specifically geared towards raiding or any other particular niche.

Okay, so looking at FFXIVCencus, your total active server population does not even come close to balmung, yet at the same time, you are on a server that obviously has a different situation when it comes to FCs. Also looking at Ultros compared to Balmung, your server has over twice as many unique characters.

So, Ultros isn't locked, seems to have a healthier meta when it comes to FCs, and fewer active characters. Where has this been discussed before?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...mmunity/page19

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ead_and_empty/


Case in point, I think your post is making me think more about moving off Balmung to Ultros simply because it probably will be easier to form the kind of group I'm after. You're view point shows that on your server, FCs that have statics built in still exist. Balmung does not have this anymore as far as I can tell because of the dam being closed on players. Also I'm aware of the age on those posts, but the discussions have continued past that point on both Reddit and the main message board, so it still stands even today.

Edit: Yeah, after looking even further into posts over the history of the forums here and in reddit, the reason we have the community on Balmung mostly using PF and not forming statics is due to the outflow problem of players leaving from across all social circles. If a social circle drops too much in number, they wont be able to manage their own static.

[YojimboM]

I'm actually making an organized playgroup and FYI if someone wants to use the word static one more time I'm going to take a giant salmon and slap them across the face several times because the term does little to inform of the amount of work required to get people comfortable working together, caught up on gear, and then breaking down the garbage barrier that PF has created from all the idiots running duty complete only and no one wanting to help late comers.

If you're creating it, you're allowed to make your own terms for joining. A static doesn't mean starting from scratch, typically you'd want to recruit like-minded people who are also ready to begin to step into raiding rather that people who aren't even at that point yet. You can require that people are geared and have put in the effort to learn their job, etc. There are many levels and varieties of statics and typically if you're looking to get better at raiding, you'll find yourself gradually moving up from beginner to casual to intermediate to even hardcore if you get that motivated.

Okay, so looking at FFXIVCencus, your total active server population does not even come close to balmung, yet at the same time, you are on a server that obviously has a different situation when it comes to FCs.

Case in point, I think your post is making me think more about moving off Balmung to Ultros simply because it probably will be easier to form the kind of group I'm after. You're view point shows that on your server, FCs that have statics built in still exist. Balmung does not have this anymore as far as I can tell because of the dam being closed on players. Also I'm aware of the age on those posts, but the discussions have continued past that point on both Reddit and the main message board, so it still stands even today.

Balmung got moved onto Crystal and a lot of the oldblood players and raiders transferred over to Aether and Primal from there. I've heard a lot of bad things about raiding and PF on Crystal, so it is probably due to the growing pains and lack of a real veteran community beyond players on Balmung and Goblin to keep things together on the DC. The number of brand new players and raiders there will make things more difficult than usual, especially ones that are non-committal or simply not ready to start raiding seriously. Your best bet would be to just transfer to Aether or Primal if you are that interested in joining a static, and joining a pre-established one most likely.

I would not personally recommend Ultros in specific. It's not a particularly special world for endgame or raiding.

And no, my "viewpoint" is not based specifically on my server. FCs with their own in-house statics exist everywhere, not only here. Nearly every major prog static is based in a specific FC and none of those are on Ultros.