Dear Paladins

[Nedkel]

So healers should ignore their oGCD kit and spam GCD heals so tanks don't get scared for being a little low on health? That's like saying, oh I'll never use holmgang/superbolide/living dead because we don't want to scare the healers.

They should not risk party a wipe, these oGCD are made that way for a reason they are emergency just like holmgang/superbolide, not for their casual use every 40-60 seconds.
There 2 more players who are better with tank NOT DYING due to a mistake.
Doing that you give your tank no space for a mistake, you have no control over him, he could get hit by 2 aoes and eat dirt and so is going everyone in the party costing you a ton more time than silly GCD use.

[Taika]

So healers should ignore their oGCD kit and spam GCD heals so tanks don't get scared for being a little low on health? That's like saying, oh I'll never use holmgang/superbolide/living dead because we don't want to scare the healers.

Yeah so it seems, healers shouldn't play their jobs well so that some tanks who don't understand how healers work won't get scared.

Edit: Of course playing the healer job well includes knowing how low you can safely let the tank drop without risking their death and a party wipe, and following their cooldown use and taking that into consideration while planning your healing. From reading this thread, it seems to me that some tanks are not very familiar with how potent healing abilities are and how they are used effectively, and get scared even when the healer is using them safely and correctly. It is of course a different matter if the healer is indeed letting their tank drop below the safe threshold, but I haven't personally witnessed that kind of a situation while playing a tank (or DPS) in dungeon pugs. From the opposite perspective, this reminds me of the pre-Shadowbringers tank stance discussions, and some healers who were complaining about tanks who were (as they should) doing dungeon boss fights in DPS stance.

[kashi11]

Yeah so it seems, healers shouldn't play their jobs well so that some tanks who don't understand how healers work won't get scared.


Edit: Of course playing the healer job well includes knowing how low you can safely let the tank drop without risking their death and a party wipe, and following their cooldown use and taking that into consideration while planning your healing. From reading this thread, it seems to me that some tanks are not very familiar with how potent healing abilities are and how they are used effectively, and get scared even when the healer is using them safely and correctly. It is of course a different matter if the healer is indeed letting their tank drop below the safe threshold, but I haven't personally witnessed that kind of a situation while playing a tank (or DPS) in dungeon pugs.

Yes, people just need to have a little more faith in the community. Better to grow as a community than gimp each other by assuming no one knows what they are doing.

[Absimiliard]

Yes, people just need to have a little more faith in the community. Better to grow as a community than gimp each other by assuming no one knows what they are doing.

You know what happens when a tank assumes healers know what they're doing? Wipes. Should always test the waters first to make sure your healer is up to the task, because a lot of them really will focus exclusively on DPS and let their tank drop down low enough that an auto could take them out. Conversely, you also encounter a lot of healers that won't DPS at all; they just spam healing spells, even when you're full.

[TheRealQuah]

Lettting a tank drop low and using big instant heals is a sign of a bad healer. If i see any healer that keeps letting me drop low for whatever reason, then i get the impression that they don't know what their doing and start using clemency more. And if they start bitching at me for using clemency a lot, i ignore them. Because you know why.

It's not a healers job to keep a tanks health at 100%. It's their job to stop it reaching 0%. If a tank doesn't die, there's nothing wrong with letting them drop low then healing.

Bad tank with a toxic attitude blaming healers for their own inadequacies.

[Fluffernuff]

It's not a healers job to keep a tanks health at 100%. It's their job to stop it reaching 0%. If a tank doesn't die, there's nothing wrong with letting them drop low then healing.

Bad tank with a toxic attitude blaming healers for their own inadequacies.

i dont necessarily agree either, but you might not wanna be the person in the mirror either. Dont be the toxic guy attacking the toxic guy. You think you're the hero, but the rest of us need to clean up all the rubble.

Frankly, being a "bad" or "good" healer based on this is....


This entire scenario is filled with a whole lot of nuance. and frankly, even on paper, you cant just say the healer is good or not based on whatever % hp the tank is at before it goes back up. or even the tank. its too broad, general, and open. a good healer might let a tank drop low momentarily to let their DPS hardcast with a tetra, bene, ED, or lustrate sitting in the back and the tank shouldnt be panicking. or the healer is bad and doesnt grasp the fact that 10k HP is death is the next server tick, because even tanks are just more blood for the blood lily.

both situations the healer is intentionally letting the tank sit low. arguing that point on opposite spectrums doesnt help, though. this "baseline" is far too broad without any other context or specific other guidelines to go off. I know this is the tank forums, but arguing whatever % of hp you keep the tank at is only going to generate more of the latter spectrum of healers if theres any sort of new or impressionable healers reading any of this.

and this is even assuming the tank is great; rotating cooldown, using tools like clemency, equib, or heaven forbid their invulns. a tank without busting any cooldowns is going to make even the best healers in the game look like a terrible one if you were too look purely as the buttons they use in a vacuum.

[Misutoraru]

It is not my job to help the healer improve when i tank or to help the tank to improve when I heal. In DF my job is to make the run as efficient as possible and letting my tank die, or causing a wipe because I need to help the heal to learn, causing the run take longer than it need then the responsibility fall to me

[Tigore]

Pretty much all of the bosses in Shadowbringers leveling dungeons has a mini tank buster that argues against letting them hover at low health. The second boss casts "The Tickler" in Holminster Switch as one example. I have used the Dark Knight barrier "The Blackest Night" and it is instantly broken by the busters (which we ironically want to happen so Dark Arts procs for a free mana attack). The Blackest Night Barrier is about 25% of the Dark Knight's Maximum HP to get a reference frame here. Do be mindful of these mechanics if you ride the danger zone to DPS more as a healer. Make sure the tank isn't going to get gibbed at 10% by "The Tickler" 3 seconds before Benediction is used.

As for the Astrologian question if 2 charges of Essential Dignity is their only oGCD heal, not quite. It's their main one, but they also have Horoscope, Collective Unconscious, and Earthly Star. Earthly Star actually does a decent AoE heal as well as a small damage burst if you let it charge for 10s. As for Collective Unconscious, I give you that to say it's not very practical to use all the time. You need people to walk into you for it to work.

[aqskerorokero]

when I need to stack 2 big cd in order to not die, that's a bad healer

[Marc-Vigar]

when I need to stack 2 big cd in order to not die, that's a bad healer

If you are stacking 2 cooldowns together, you're the bad tank.