Which rule states that parses can't be posted in chat?

[Vnolan]

Parsing is not officially allowed under the "third-party applications that do so and so" part of the ToS, but what about posting a parse?

1. You're several runs deep into a farm party when someone is curious about how they're doing. You, who has no access to a parser, notices someone else in the party uploaded previous runs. You decide to let the player know how much they did.

2. You don't have access to parser, but you're in a party with someone streaming that does. Someone wants to know their numbers so you check the stream and let them know.

In both examples you would be at risk of receiving a temp ban if someone else in the party decided to report you, but in both cases you wouldn't be parsing, so which rule would be broken?

Information obtained from parses couldn't be forbidden since there are regularly topics on these forums before patches go live that include info that was datamined.

[Bearded]

Just because there are regular topics about parsers does not mean that the information gleamed from them is for public discussion and publishing especially in game.

People regularly drive without seat belts and using mobile phones - it's more about enforcement rather than it being allowed.

I do not use a parser but I would suggest, never, ever tell someone their stats even if you know they use one themselves UNLESS they specifically ask you to do so and even then be aware that posting such data in game can get you in trouble.

[NessaWyvern]

I do not use a parser but I would suggest, never, ever tell someone their stats even if you know they use one themselves UNLESS they specifically ask you to do so and even then be aware that posting such data in game can get you in trouble.

Someone was asked to post parsing numbers once in chat, and when they they did, a player reported them, and they got a temp ban. They did not use it to harass. Best not to post it in FF14 chat, full stop.

[Astrus]

There is, as far as I know, no specific rule against posting parses in chat if you're not treading into discrimination/harassment territory in doing so.
That said, parsers are handled on a "don't ask, don't tell" basis since technically they violate the third-party application clause you mentioned above.

Since SE doesn't scan your PC for an active parser they have no idea whether you are parsing or not but you posting a parse indicates that you are.
If someone reports you it's going to be hard to prove whether you're parsing or obtained the numbers elsewhere so your chances of successfully appealing whatever SE decide to do with the circumstantial evidence are slim to say the least.

In both your examples the best course of action would be to take a minute between runs and provide a link to the log, or stream, or just the raw numbers, in a whisper to the player who requested them so you minimize the risk of anyone reporting you for bringing up parses.

[Penthea]

There is, as far as I know, no specific rule against posting parses in chat if you're not treading into discrimination/harassment territory in doing so.

@OP of the thread:

Using any third party software is against the ToS. If you post a parse result in chat then the implication is that you are using a parser, and because that information can only be gotten from third party software you're basically saying "hey look at me, I'm breaking the rules!".

There's no law that prevents you from shouting "I robbed the old lady down the street" but if you say it around the wrong person or say it enough times, you are going to draw attention to yourself and get your activity investigated. The same applies to talking about parse results in chat. Even if the result was requested by someone in the party and it caused no harm, it doesn't change that using third party software isn't allowed.

You're not going to get away with posting parse results by saying "there's no rule against posting them" to a GM. Just post them in something like discord instead.

[Astrus]

Using any third party software is against the ToS. If you post a parse result in chat then the implication is that you are using a parser, and because that information can only be gotten from third party software you're basically saying "hey look at me, I'm breaking the rules!".

There's no law that prevents you from shouting "I robbed the old lady down the street" but if you say it around the wrong person or say it enough times, you are going to draw attention to yourself and get your activity investigated. The same applies to talking about parse results in chat.

You're not going to get away with posting parse results by saying "there's no rule against posting them" to a GM.

Which is precisely what my post you quoted goes on to say, glad we're on the same page.

[Penthea]

Which is precisely what my post you quoted goes on to say, glad we're on the same page.

I should have made it clearer that what I said was directed at OP and not you. I edited my post for clarification.

[Kaethra]

You're not going to get away with posting parse results by saying "there's no rule against posting them" to a GM. Just post them in something like discord instead.

Discord is a third party program. You can be banned for that.

Same with those using Steam to access the game.

See.. there's an issue with a strict interpretation of the rules. You're first reaction is.. "what? no... Steam and Discord are fine for obvious reasons.."

Are they? What if I use a bot or script in Discord to parse? What if I use a mod on steamworkshop in one of the other games to analyze a set of text files?

The problem comes in that they have to move outside their wheelhouse to make a decision. It would be a bit different if they said, no parse data period. It would cover all those grey areas. But they didn't. Why is that? They didn't even say "don't post parse in FFXIV based chats". They leave it ambiguous. The only rules they have is don't use third party hacks and cheats and programs. Which doesn't include, VOIP. But VOIP can be used for this very thing.

Guess some of you are going to have to start reporting discord links. This makes things interesting.

[Penthea]

Discord is a third party program. You can be banned for that.

No you can't because it doesn't interact with the game in any way, and it doesn't get information from the game directly.

Same with those using Steam to access the game.

In this case there is a literal legal agreement between Steam and SE for the game to be purchasable and launchable through Steam.

In the case of parsers they interact with the game by using information it feeds them without a legal agreement with SE. See the difference?

The problem comes in that they have to move outside their wheelhouse to make a decision. It would be a bit different if they said, no parse data period. It would cover all those grey areas. But they didn't. Why is that? They didn't even say "don't post parse in FFXIV based chats". They leave it ambiguous. The only rules they have is don't use third party hacks and cheats and programs. Which doesn't include, VOIP. But VOIP can be used for this very thing.

They leave parsers ambiguous because they know they're too useful for the community to completely stop using them. It's in a "don't ask don't tell in the game or official forums" state. And for some reason people get really confused about something as straightforward as "don't talk about it where SE can see it"

Guess some of you are going to have to start reporting discord links. This makes things interesting.

If all they're sharing are discord handles or server invites then they cannot get reported for that.

[Kaethra]

No you can't because it doesn't interact with the game in any way, and it doesn't get information from the game directly.

Discord very much can interact with the game in the same way a Parser can. Do a quick search on what discord scripts can do.