SMN; How do poison DoTs fit the class?

[Sinh119]

Well you get them as Arcanist for a reason. They are Arcanist techniques specifically, which is why Scholar also has them. Your complaint is more that Summoner doesn't fit as a branch of the Arcanist class, which is valid. As Summoners focus more on demi-primals it makes less and less sense that we are tied to the Arcanist class, to the point where Summoner should really just be its own thing. If they really wanted to they could just replace Bio and Miasma with primal-themed equivalents, but they seem to want to make sure that link to the Arcanist class is still there, and so Bio and Miasma (along with physick) are what we have.

[Taranok]

Well you get them as Arcanist for a reason. They are Arcanist techniques specifically, which is why Scholar also has them. Your complaint is more that Summoner doesn't fit as a branch of the Arcanist class, which is valid. As Summoners focus more on demi-primals it makes less and less sense that we are tied to the Arcanist class, to the point where Summoner should really just be its own thing. If they really wanted to they could just replace Bio and Miasma with primal-themed equivalents, but they seem to want to make sure that link to the Arcanist class is still there, and so Bio and Miasma (along with physick) are what we have.

It's also worth noting that Arcanist originally was designed to support what would become the Summoner in ARR. Which is to say SMN was designed to be a WoW Warlock knockoff with its own bizarro mechanics because the devs didn't quite understand or know where they wanted the class to go and thought the Egi system was the better choice, mixed with 4 DoTs (Bio, Miasma, Bio 2, I think they had Miasma 2 as an aoe DoT, and Shadowflare, though M2 was never used ST). Plus the pets which had an awful implementation that stuck through SB only to be made into a better-but-still-bad implementation in ShB.

So the devs have been trying desperately to keep the core of the class the same (the original poison mage design of ARR) so they wouldn't need to do major edits to the class or rewrites of the lore, but in SB they hit upon the right way to implement summons in FFXIV, and in ShB pushed the class towards that.

Fast forward a bit and you can see the disjointed problem trying to salvage the core design caused. SMN stopped being a true poison mage in SB, but it's being kept because the devs don't want to change the core, which is why this is turning into a mess that doesn't fit either thematically or gameplay wise.

The lore of Arcanist was written to facilitate ARR's summoner, but it no longer fits how Summoner plays now because the current summoner is the closest to a true summoner FFXIV has ever had, while also being the furthest away from poison mage it's ever been, so the class just feels like a mess because of it.

[CapricaLangley]

Arcanist controls the nearby aether to create blasting energies and summon primals by rerouting and channeling aether lines.
But, how does Miasma and Bio fit with that?

It's pretty obvious that the Damage over Time concept was created to support the idea of a pet class. Between one DoT application and the other, the ideal Summoner would weave a lot of pet skills and multiple different summons. In the end, the team changed the concept but choose to retain the initian defining trait.

[Nyoraii]

Oh would you look at that:

https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki...play#Abilities

Level 10 and Level 26.

Did you even read the page you posted? Bio and Poison are BLACK MAGICS! This has nothing to do with Rydia being a Summoner, she has two classes, same as Yuna being a Summoner and a White Mage. But that doesn't mean Holy, Cure and Esuna are Summoning magics, obviously.

Just admit, the design for SMN in this game is just a poor excuse for a wow Warlock because the devs had no idea how to make a pet class work without copying it from other games, maybe because of incompetence, maybe because of time constraints.

[Razard]

Did you even read the page you posted? Bio and Poison are BLACK MAGICS! This has nothing to do with Rydia being a Summoner, she has two classes, same as Yuna being a Summoner and a White Mage. But that doesn't mean Holy, Cure and Esuna are Summoning magics, obviously.

Ahh But you said:

Summoner is a classic FF job, it has never ever had anything to do with DoTs.

So here is a classic Summoner, from a village of Summoners, using poison magic, which have Damage Over Time properties.

So yeah, there is a precedent.

[Sequora]

Ahh But you said:



So here is a classic Summoner, from a village of Summoners, using poison magic, which have Damage Over Time properties.

So yeah, there is a precedent.

It still feels lazy. One summoner in the history of the series had two spells. It was definitely laziness. Diseases and poisons go with pet classes in so many other MMOs. Every other class flows into their job. Tham flows very naturally into BLM. Gladiator flows very naturally into PLD. Arcanist does not flow well into SMN.

[dinnertime]

It still feels lazy. One summoner in the history of the series had two spells. It was definitely laziness. Diseases and poisons go with pet classes in so many other MMOs. Every other class flows into their job. Tham flows very naturally into BLM. Gladiator flows very naturally into PLD. Arcanist does not flow well into SMN.

You're forgetting Bard lol

[Brightshadow]

Black Mage is her subjob not her main.

[Nyoraii]

Ahh But you said:
So here is a classic Summoner, from a village of Summoners, using poison magic, which have Damage Over Time properties.

So yeah, there is a precedent.

You know you're not making any sense right now, right? Again, with your same flawed reasoning, Summoners should also have white magic because Garnet/Eiko were Summoners and White Mages.

Rydia could use Poison and Bio because she also has access to Black Magic, from the same page you posted:

She is the first dedicated Summoner in the Final Fantasy series, and also excels in casting Black Magic,

It doesn't have anything to do with Summoning.

[Dyvid]

Arcanist controls the nearby aether to create blasting energies and summon primals by rerouting and channeling aether lines.
But, how does Miasma and Bio fit with that?

Because when it in came out 2013, SE wanted a Magic Ranged DPS that casts direct damage spells (BLM) and a Magic Ranged DPS that uses pets and DoTs (SMN). They didn't want two jobs to play exactly the same way. /thread