Ran'ji > WoD + Oracle of Light + Scorn!?

[TankHunter678]

Losing is fine, but when a character dominates us effortlessly and then we beat them later for no apparent reason THAT is when I have a problem with it. .

I want to point out that we were actually beating Ran'jit before he figured out how our power flow worked and immobilized us (or at least I was, I got him down to half health before he pulled the move off and I was still topped off in health on my SAM). He showed off his special move, which proceeded to never work again against us when he used it later because our characters had figured it out in return. So the next time we actually seriously fought we straight up beat him, despite him fighting in his powered up form. Were it not for that one move he pulled we would have killed him back at Laxan Loft.

The problem though is that Ran'jit was not our villain narratively. He was the equivalent of a mid-boss for the mid-boss. He was Thancred's major villain and foil, so Thancred should have been the one to give him the final blow.

[PeppermintBrown]

I want to point out that we were actually beating Ran'jit before he figured out how our power flow worked and immobilized us (or at least I was, I got him down to half health before he pulled the move off and I was still topped off in health on my SAM). He showed off his special move, which proceeded to never work again against us when he used it later because our characters had figured it out in return. So the next time we actually seriously fought we straight up beat him, despite him fighting in his powered up form. Were it not for that one move he pulled we would have killed him back at Laxan Loft.

The problem though is that Ran'jit was not our villain narratively. He was the equivalent of a mid-boss for the mid-boss. He was Thancred's major villain and foil, so Thancred should have been the one to give him the final blow.

I agree he should have died after Thancred's fight with him.

As for our rematch with him there I never saw a moment that was like 'hah that's not gonna work now' just the same old 'avoid aoes while fighting him.' The first duel with him also didn't feel like we were beating him to me. When he says 'now i have your measure' it seemed to me he was just testing us and decided he was done toying around and went in for the win.

[RopeDrink]

If the best you can do is die without putting up a fight and submitting yourself to a tyrant along with every other soul you know, then you may as well stop fighting all together. He didn't do that. He actively stood in the way of people trying to make a difference and was putting down people willing to, at the very least, try to fight for a world for their children. Call it for what it is. If you give it your all till it becomes too much, only to turn on those still fighting, that is the definition of being a traitor. And traitors should get what they deserve. What help he gave when Minfilia was actively trying to save the First was washed away when he decided that what he wanted was more important than her mission (saving the First). If a cutscene was added that at least made him falter in his current belief that the world was beyond saving, maybe I would have received his character better. As it stands he was just an annoyance and generally lackluster when it comes to being a well developed antagonist. He was only a stepping stone to our salvation of the First when he could have been an ally. He got off easy.

I get what you're saying, but you say it like the timeframe doesn't exist, or that it's 'lacklustre' for a character (originally of good intent) to be worn down and converted to the bad side after a near-century of being soul-crushed in an unwinnable battle. I can see why someone would become dishevelled and eventually buy into the concept of 'peace' (despite it being provided via horrible means) when discussing someone who has endured nothing but loss and despair for practically 100 years of combat. If you can't, that's fine, so I'll just repeat my previous comment:

^ Above mentality discredits the untold number of years/generations he fought against the Sin-Eaters, training those Minfilia's and seeing them cut down, time and time again. This wasn't some rando who saw Vauthry and immediately bent the knee - this is a chap who was likely Numero Uno in the Sin-Eater slaying department on the First who had nothing to show for almost a century of fighting but constant defeat (or as close to it as you can get without being wiped out). Then Emet comes along, instigates the birth of a human Sin Eater who can control those beasties. You'd be tired too after all that time and far more susceptible to the notion that maybe throwing your lot in with that obese scumbag would be preferable to fighting for the losing side which now also has people defecting/mind-controlled and bleeding out numbers without even fighting at all. If not for himself, then for the other Minfilia's.

Remember, Ran's most commonly used words are "Peace" - while regarding us as the "Villains" for taking away said peace (however corrupt) from a child. Nobody is going to defend or justify his actions or motives, but they are easy to understand. Try to imagine fighting the Sin-Eater wars for decades on end, training the closest thing to a saviour time and time again and repeatedly watching them die, until finally, some semblance of peace is actually established (by a different means). I'd feel no pity if this was some random pleb who wanted a piece of that Eulmore peace-pie and threw themselves at it without thought, but we're talking about someone who (at one point) did fight for the right cause for practically a whole lifetime being withered down by it.

But anyway.

[FrejyaAthenes]

Much like the "Ran'Jit is part Sin Eater" theory, I never quite saw how Ran'Jit beating us was a result of some strange new technique that we just happened to figure out later.

[TankHunter678]

Much like the "Ran'Jit is part Sin Eater" theory, I never quite saw how Ran'Jit beating us was a result of some strange new technique that we just happened to figure out later.

If you look at the fight in Laxan Loft he disables us with a very specific lightning based attack. When he faced us again in Eulmore he used that same attack but it failed to disable us.

[FrejyaAthenes]

If you look at the fight in Laxan Loft he disables us with a very specific lightning based attack. When he faced us again in Eulmore he used that same attack but it failed to disable us.

That could also be argued as we're too strong for it to work on (ie. "we leveled up"), same with how Zenos stopped being able to stun us except for when we were in Yotsuyu's head.

I mean, I get the idea, but what I want to understand is how did people here translate that to "He's using a special technique that blocks off our aetheric flow that we later figured out while we were doing everything else in the story?" Again, with Fordola we're definitively shown taking measures to overcome her ability. With Ran'Jit, it feels more like people are making guesses.

Like, if it doesn't work because we "figured it out," what exactly did we figure out and how did we stop it?