Is Ninja really that weak?

[Adventica6]

Nin is behind Brd in dps on fflogs so yes, it's weak, that is also including the rdps from TA. No other way to slice it, it's the AST of Dps.

[Realism_Snide]

Yes. To me, Ninja does feel really weak, not because its personal dps is weak, but because I feel like it doesn't have enough raid support and utility to warrant this weak personal dps. I want to do more than just press TA every 60 seconds, and would gladly exchange our new jutsus, TCJ, and increased potencies for something to replace the aggro control and Goad we used to have. Not only that, but using TA feels aweful to use now cause we now need to cram more buttons in that 10 second window. I understand Yoshi-P's concerns with not wanting a team comp meta, but that is more of a community problem and system designs problem than a job design one, in my honest opinion, and the direction they took ninja in ShB just doesn't feel good.

[Seraphor]

Ninja doesn't need an all round buff, and TA doesn't need to go.
It just needs to be able to personally exploit the TA window a little better. Giving it more reason to even use TA when solo, or even in 4-man parties.

Buff Bunshin a little, and make Assassinate as powerful as DwaD. (why is a skill that's called 'Assassinate' such a low potency?)
Gives it a bit of extra burst damage to bring it up to speed with the other melee jobs. Without lowering skill ceiling.

[Laur1x]

Ninja doesn't need an all round buff, and TA doesn't need to go.
It just needs to be able to personally exploit the TA window a little better. Giving it more reason to even use TA when solo, or even in 4-man parties.

Buff Bunshin a little, and make Assassinate as powerful as DwaD. (why is a skill that's called 'Assassinate' such a low potency?)
Gives it a bit of extra burst damage to bring it up to speed with the other melee jobs. Without lowering skill ceiling.

So you want to give us even more burst? That's hardly the issue with NIN. We already burst harder than most jobs, but we fall off hard after the TA opener because our sustained is doo-doo.

Making TA last 15-20 seconds at only 5%, and buffing some of our potencenies so our sustained is cleaner is a much better option. Still bring utility, but they can bring our pDPS in line with other melee.

...Or just remove TA like most NIN's want because balancing around this stupid ability is a nightmare.

[Seraphor]

So you want to give us even more burst?

Yes. I want it to doubledown on it's unique quirk, instead of homogenizing everything.
I want TA to be more meaningful for solo play and personal DPS.

It's role is an assassin, generally weaker, but hitting weak spots hard.

...Or just remove TA like most NIN's want because balancing around this stupid ability is a nightmare.

Yes lets remove the USP of the job, like every other job in the game, so that they all play the same way.


Or as a compromise. TA increases damage received by target by 5%, and increases your personal damage by 5%.
This'll give them more leeway to buff their personal damage, but again, mainly in their burst capability. There is no way a dexterity based rogue should consistently hit as hard as a Dragoon or Samurai.

[KageTokage]

I hope they get some potency buffs in tomorrow's patch because I've been maining the class since day 1 but don't want to feel like a liability in savage.

[Laur1x]

Yes. I want it to doubledown on it's unique quirk, instead of homogenizing everything.
I want TA to be more meaningful for solo play and personal DPS.

It's role is an assassin, generally weaker, but hitting weak spots hard.

Yes lets remove the USP of the job, like every other job in the game, so that they all play the same way.

Or as a compromise. TA increases damage received by target by 5%, and increases your personal damage by 5%.
This'll give them more leeway to buff their personal damage, but again, mainly in their burst capability. There is no way a dexterity based rogue should consistently hit as hard as a Dragoon or Samurai.

I'd rather them homogenize things more and all DPS be within a few % of each other than keeping "unique" skills like TA, having enforced metas, and being a glorified buff-bot while all the other DPS get to be 10, 15, and 20% ahead.

Obviously Ninja shouldn't hit as hard as SAM/DRG, when did I say that? Rogues generally don't hit as "hard", but they hit twice as fast because of dual-wield. They can have burst windows and then moderate sustained, I can careless about how "big" the numbers are, I care about the final DPS number at the end of a fight. In what MMO has the Rogue/Sin class ever been a bottom-dwelling support class? Sure, they may have CC's, or debuffs to expose a target, but at the end of the day they're usually one of the higher skill ceiling + higher DPS classes. FFXIV should be no different.

[rxnin]

Every job has their signature move.

War has Fell Cleave, Dark Knight has TBN, Samurai has Midare Setsugekka, etc.

Ninja has Trick Attack. Leave it alone. Don't touch it.

Nerf our DPS, fine! Buff our DPS, great! But don't change anything about Trick Attack. It's in a perfect place.

The haters will hate on us, but we will endure. Because we can take it. That's our ninja way. Believe it!

[Remonade]

The haters will hate on us, but we will endure. Because we can take it. That's our ninja way. Believe it!

You just gained hokage levels of respect from me well said.

[Powercow]

Patch notes are out. I'm sorry for getting anyone's hopes up about today's patch.