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  1. #9
    Player
    Shougun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    9,431
    Character
    Wubrant Drakesbane
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Siete View Post
    Simple, we're not 24/7 at 100% brain activity thinking everything we do, our brains have premade paths of neural thinking and reacting created by repetition repetition repetition and repetition. So we're mostly on automode, otherwise our brains would literally boil.
    So, when we talk, much of what we spew is made by this auto-mode.
    If you want people to use those "new" ways of reffering to someone, they have to get those neural patterns remade. Which by the way, it's quite taxing, energy demanding and mildly painful. Just like studying.
    Basically, it's a huge effort, you should be enormously thankful to people who make such a titanic task as rewiring their neuronal network just so you hear the "right" word when they talk to you.
    I'm reminded of someone I've known for a long time changing their name. Definitely messes with the flow for a while, and I still mess it up lol. But they're patient and never give me grief or attempt to correct me and I always correct myself.

    Also beyond names though gender's definition seems to be called into question more so than in the loose assumed past (wasn't really any wiggle room or allowed discussion on it), some see it more of a state of mind and others a state of biology. Unfortunately for both parties who both want to be right there is the issue that language is not distinctly prescriptive. . . A bit like living culture. So even if it was supposed to be X or should be X doesn't mean it will be once the majority adopt a meaning.

    A minor silly example to me is I know the group words for many animals but I don't use them because I feel it's silly and would like to promote simpler groupings, as cool as a murder of crows sounds I feel it's not helpful for the language and so I "do my part" in helping that continue to become archaic (like when corrected by someone suggesting to use the animal group word I'd say thanks and then continue not to use that word lol).

    Quote Originally Posted by Doozer View Post
    I'm pretty sure it's only hard to call someone "they" if you're stubborn and refuse to change your ways. It's actually pretty easy. If you care enough about showing everyone the minimum amount of respect to call them the right name, pronouns, etc., then it's not hard. Saying it's too difficult shows a lack of respect under most circumstances (unless you have some sort of condition that may make such things more difficult, but most people don't).
    The issue there is that respect is not always a universal value (subjective). I think a nice example is if someone says "if you don't believe in my god you don't respect me, this is how I view life, how I view the world, everything - it's clearly important to my existence as a person". Honestly that could be a form of disrespect, to them, if you don't show the respect they ask. But especially in the world of religion I would say as a society we know that you don't have to follow their rituals in order to respect them as a person, that you can respect someone of a different religion while also thinking it's false, thinking nothing of it, or worse. Keeping in mind for some religion is a core part of their existence/identity.

    So if they ask a person to call them something that the other person doesn't want to, it doesn't demand that it's necessarily disrespect (to the person whose not doing the request, of course the person who's request ignored might feel differently). Or like if your friend asks if the pants make their bum look big, would it be disrespectful to tell the truth? For some no, for others yes. In fact sometimes we have cases where pain is a form of respect "should I tell my friend's partner that my friend is cheating on them?" - it doesn't have to be disrespect to tell the partner the truth (could even say you're respecting your friend by encouraging them to be a better person).

    I think the subjectivity is a bit self evident but just wanted to say it because I feel sometimes the respect aspect is brought up as if it was the same truth for everyone. For some, in their own mind, they could refuse to say what you want and still respect you greatly.

    Personally I tend to enjoy a relationship of give and take, so I'd use they as a symbol of give but also expect the same sort of flexibility back. If asked to do something then I would find it fair play space (within reason lol). Like I dislike the whole "white cishet male" thing, I know for some it's just a description and nothing more (not intended to be rude, though I feel some use it like a negative. . which is part of why I probably find it annoying), as to me I'm not just my gender or color and I don't want to be labeled or addressed as such (I've been introduced almost as if that was part of my title or name and I asked for them not to do that, which they obliged and of course I thanked them).
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    Last edited by Shougun; 07-27-2019 at 06:47 AM.