What about creating an ACTUAL Dark Knight?

[Stepjam]

Dark mind is usually pretty good during raids cobsidering usually raid tank busters are magic damage. They got bad luck this tier.

But TBN alone puts Drk in a pretty great place tbh

[Kaedan]

Found my old explanation of the "road of DRK's identity":

I think in order to make DRK "feel like a DRK", we have to explore the identity of DRK.

It was first playable in FF3, but most of the NA audience never played 3. So really, our first exposure was FF4, in the form of Cecil. Cecil as a Dark Knight could use the ability "Darkness" which cost HP, but did damage to all enemies. He had high HP and Def and could use swords and shields and heavy armor.

It didn't appear again until FFX-2 as a dressphere. There, it also had Darkness (aoe) and Charon (single target version of Darkness), and Arcana. It also had proof against most if not all status ailments. It still had high HP and Def.

It next appeared in FFXI as a DPS class. It lost a lot of it's identity here, as it was basically turned into a hybrid caster/melee. Could use black magic and stat-absorb spells, had access to early Stun and could gain TP really fast. Also lots of Draining abilities.

It appeared in FF: Tactics PSP version (war of the lions), and there it focused on HP/MP drain.



So the major themes of DRK have been:

-High HP

-High Def

-Darkness (sacrifice HP for damage or later HP/MP drain)

-Drain/Absorb

-Ailment immunity and or infliction/absorb



I think FF14's DRK actually fits those themes fairly well. We don't have the HP sacrifice part, but they changed it to MP sacrifice (the mp management mechanics). They kept the high HP and Def themes, as well as the Drain/Absorb aspects.

I agree with the other poster that the biggest thing is just getting rid of the Dark Arts spam. Not only is it annoying, but it trivializes the "lore" of the ability as well to have to spam it so much.

[Ultimatecalibur]

Found my old explanation of the "road of DRK's identity":

I think in order to make DRK "feel like a DRK", we have to explore the identity of DRK.

It was first playable in FF3, but most of the NA audience never played 3. So really, our first exposure was FF4, in the form of Cecil. Cecil as a Dark Knight could use the ability "Darkness" which cost HP, but did damage to all enemies. He had high HP and Def and could use swords and shields and heavy armor.

It didn't appear again until FFX-2 as a dressphere. There, it also had Darkness (aoe) and Charon (single target version of Darkness), and Arcana. It also had proof against most if not all status ailments. It still had high HP and Def.

It next appeared in FFXI as a DPS class. It lost a lot of it's identity here, as it was basically turned into a hybrid caster/melee. Could use black magic and stat-absorb spells, had access to early Stun and could gain TP really fast. Also lots of Draining abilities.

It appeared in FF: Tactics PSP version (war of the lions), and there it focused on HP/MP drain.

You have a few things out of order here.

Dark Knight's 3rd appearance was in FFT(PS) (1997) as Gafgarion's exclusive job with 2 special attacks that dealt Dark element damage and recovered either HP or MP.

XI (2002) and the Advanced Job Dark Knight was released before X-2 (2003) and its Dark Knight.

[Mahoukenshi]

You have a few things out of order here.

Dark Knight's 3rd appearance was in FFT(PS) (1997) as Gafgarion's exclusive job with 2 special attacks that dealt Dark element damage and recovered either HP or MP.

XI (2002) and the Advanced Job Dark Knight was released before X-2 (2003) and its Dark Knight.

There was also the the FF3 remake for Nintendo 3DS, where IIRC Dark Knight was only(?) a mid-tier job in the grand scale of things and had also the all-enemy hp-draining skill. It was recommended to use them with Bards for synergy during the parts the combo was valid.

[Reynhart]

There was also the the FF3 remake for Nintendo 3DS, where IIRC Dark Knight was only(?) a mid-tier job in the grand scale of things and had also the all-enemy hp-draining skill. It was recommended to use them with Bards for synergy during the parts the combo was valid.

In FF III, the only uniqueness of DRK was to be able to use Katanas...that prevent monsters from multiplying.

[Reynhart]

but they changed it to MP sacrifice (the mp management mechanics).

MP is a ressource meant to be spent, you don't "sacrifice" it. And the MP management has been reduced to the bare minimum since we only have 3 skills to spend them, with basically the same end result.

Also in FFIV, if you look at Cecil's stats as a Dark Knight, he's actually pretty low in HP and stamina. It just so happens that several of your teammates are mages so they are weaker than you. Just compare his stats to Kain's or Yang's.

[Ultimatecalibur]

Also in FFIV, if you look at Cecil's stats as a Dark Knight, he's actually pretty low in HP and stamina. It just so happens that several of your teammates are mages so they are weaker than you. Just compare his stats to Kain's or Yang's.

Dark Knight Cecil's Stats are actually superior to Kain's for the level range that they appear together (and only really start exceeding DK Cecil's at the levels where you should have Paladin Cecil). Yang's stats are inflated to make up for Yang's inferior equipment.

[Reynhart]

Dark Knight Cecil's Stats are actually superior to Kain's for the level range that they appear together (and only really start exceeding DK Cecil's at the levels where you should have Paladin Cecil).

It's not that uncommon to reach lvl20 before changing to Paladin. At that point, a lvl 20 Kain would trump you in HP. In fact, a level 1 Paladin Cecil has around 50% more HP than a level 20 Dark Cecil. How can someone say that Dark Knight was a "high HP, high def" job in that game ?

[Kabooa]

It's not that uncommon to reach lvl20 before changing to Paladin. At that point, a lvl 20 Kain would trump you in HP. In fact, a level 1 Paladin Cecil has around 50% more HP than a level 20 Dark Cecil. How can someone say that Dark Knight was a "high HP, high def" job in that game ?

Because for the first half of the game, you're paired with almost exclusively Wizards of some variety.

[MagiusNecros]

How can someone say that Dark Knight was a "high HP, high def" job in that game ?

FFIV is character driven and not class driven.

FF3: Heavy Armor, AoE specialist, ignores defense

FF4: Used as a plot point to transition into a PLD, shares AoE from FF3. Which uses HP and has a CD of 2 turns.

FF8: Darkside command from Guardian Forces which expend HP to deal damage.

FFX-2: Status Immunity, HP sacrificing attacks

FFXI : Heavy Armor, skills that focus on absorb/drain, debuffs
Tactics:Heavy Armor, HP and MP absorb, HP sacrificing attacks

FF4HoL: Darkside action to sacrifice HP for damage

BDFF/BDFF2: Heavy Armor primarily Helmets, HP sacrificing attacks, stat increases on receiving damage, blow up when you are KO'd dealing AoE damage on death, ability to absorb all magic damage and convert it into MP and take no damage, cast doom on self to boost all stats, Minus Strike which lands attacks they do damage based on missing HP. Hitting an enemy say at 10/500 HP will make it land for 490 damage.

FF Dimensions: HP sacrificing attacks, Draw Attacks which is a provoke to focus on the DRK, Last Resort is another ability that inflicts doom on self to buff stats, Final Thrust is an attack based on hit point total and low success rate at high HP, HP absorb.

A general breakdown of DRK over the series shows prominent use of heavy armor and HP sacrificing attacks with the occasional status immunity and interesting anti magic tank skills.

Mostly prominent in the BDFF subseries.

It's all on the wikia for you to gloss over.