Can we start getting serious about having ARR restructured?

[Jeeves72]

As I'm sure we all know, A Realm Reborn is by far the biggest road block for new players, and it's essentially the only reason we cannot recommend the game without throwing in a hefty caveat re: how much of a slog ARR is. There's also the problem of players being overleveled by the time they hit Heavensward.

I don't think it would be too big of an undertaking for the developer to pare down the number of quests (imagine an ARR postgame consisting of, say, 20 quests), and possibly even turning a few of the dungeons currently required for story progression into optional dungeons. They could smooth things over with altered dialogue in order to shuffle around some story events if need be.

While they're at it, they could standardize the outdated AoE/mechanics markers in older content to be more consistent with what players will see in the rest of the game.


EDIT: They are officially doing it. They hope to have it done by 5.3

[DrWho2010]

if it wasn't "that big of an undertaking" they would have done it by now. it is EXTREMELY difficult to go back and change the coding involved with 2.x stuff. they have made mention of this many times. they want to but the time and effort involved is a lot. they're more concerned with moving forward than looking back.

[Hezzlocks]

if it wasn't "that big of an undertaking" they would have done it by now. it is EXTREMELY difficult to go back and change the coding involved with 2.x stuff. they have made mention of this many times. they want to but the time and effort involved is a lot. they're more concerned with moving forward than looking back.

Personally I think most of ARR is fine and can be kept as is. There's really only 4 things that needs to change.

First, the Titan questline, which is full of many seemingly pointless filler quests that make you go back and forth several times then makes you go fight a dragon in Brayflox Longstop for some gobbie cheese (nothing against gobbie cheese, it's just this random thing follows many other random things). A little bit of pruning here on the more tedious quests that don't really do anything, bump up the XP on the remaining quests to compensate.

Second, the MSQ 50 dungeons. These dungeons are in dire need of a rework. This is actually one of the two biggest problem areas in ARR, as it just isn't fun for either newcomers nor vets alike. I'd preferably rework it into a solo dungeon experience, to preserve as much of the feel of it as possible while also letting newcomers experience it at their own pace *and* saving SE from needing to lure vets into the roulette with bloated rewards. If only this one thing changes, it would be a huge deal.

Third, and the *other* biggest thing to change, even more important than the MSQ dungeons, is the patches 2.1-2.5. Yes, they are important to the story, but also yes they are often tedious and seemingly endless. There are several filler quests through the patches that could very easily be dropped out entirely, or at the very least converted into sidequests. The Domans come to mind, notably playing hide and seek with the children and, err, "Sniff the Chocobo". Since HW is designed to be entered at level 50, and you need to be level 50 to enter the MSQ dungeons, you could very safely compress the 2.X patches by dropping out a lot of the filler without worrying about XP *at all*. If only this one thing changes, it would be an incredible boon for ARR.

Finally, much less important but still tedious, less of the "Pray, return to the Waking Sands". We have linkpearls for a reason, after all. That said, Minfilia gets precious little screentime outside of these scenes, so I suppose there really isn't much you can do about that.

[Jeeves72]

All I mean is that I'm sure that Square has the resources to accomplish the task. I'm glad that they've mentioned it, but I think a community push may help them rethink their priorities in order to actually get it done. The game is very popular right now and streamlining the first portion of the game would go a long way towards keeping that momentum. I have no doubt that the ARR slog has caused many to quit who otherwise wouldn't have, and will continue to do so.

As it is now, ARR gives a bad first impression to an otherwise wonderful game.

[kidalutz]

All I mean is that I'm sure that Square has the resources to accomplish the task. I'm glad that they've mentioned it, but I think a community push may help them rethink their priorities in order to actually get it done. The game is very popular right now and streamlining the first portion of the game would go a long way towards keeping that momentum. I have no doubt that the ARR slog has caused many to quit who otherwise wouldn't have, and will continue to do so.

As it is now, ARR gives a bad first impression to an otherwise wonderful game.

Thats your opinon but it was ARRs content that sold me on the rest of the game *shrug* To each thier own.

[ShinShimon]

SE would probably recoup more money in the long run if they just give the FF14 team the resources to do this on top of rolling out new content. If that won't happen, I'd even take reduced content in a 5.X patch if it means ARR gets fixed. I can think if 2-3 people that would be playing the game right now if not for ARR's horrible slog, and that's not counting the people I don't even bother to recommend the game to.

[Enkidoh]

Well, don't take it the wrong way but if certain people are complaining about not being to just skip straight to endgame quickly, then this game probably is not for them. The fact is, FFXIV is a FF game first and a MMO second, and FF games are always story focused, even the MMOs. Here normal MMO trappings of everything being about endgame raiding and stuff for 'shinez' and streetcred is only one part of the package (and is really only a minor part, if Yoshi's comments in the past about the amount of players really doing endgame content, let alone completing it, is any indication).

The story is an important part of that, and is meant to guide players gradually into the action, not just dumping everything into their lap at once and leaving it at that. Those who state that the game really is about endgame are sadly mistaken, and they're the ones who usually end up most disappointed and bored.

There is much more to this game than running Savage and Ultimate raids and trials. The game is a journey, not a spectacle, and the journey to get to endgame is just as important, if not more so, than the destination.

[Jeeves72]

Well, don't take it the wrong way but if certain people are complaining about not being to just skip straight to endgame quickly, then this game probably is not for them. The fact is, FFXIV is a FF game first and a MMO second, and FF games are always story focused, even the MMOs. Here normal MMO trappings of everything being about endgame raiding and stuff for 'shinez' and streetcred is only one part of the package (and is really only a minor part, if Yoshi's comments in the past about the amount of players really doing endgame content, let alone completing it, is any indication).

The story is an important part of that, and is meant to guide players gradually into the action, not just dumping everything into their lap at once and leaving it at that. Those who state that the game really is about endgame are sadly mistaken, and they're the ones who usually end up most disappointed and bored.

There is much more to this game than running Savage and Ultimate raids and trials. The game is a journey, not a spectacle, and the journey to get to endgame is just as important, if not more so, than the destination.

I'm all about the journey. Though I'm at the level cap and all that, I've never even dipped a toe in Savage, Ultimate etc. Problem is, the early part of that journey is notoriously poor as-is, and it can turn off newer players.

I don't know what you're trying to accomplish by misrepresenting my suggestion as "skipping straight to the endgame quickly". I would like to see new players experience the full breadth of the story by trimming the excess of fat from ARR while preserving its story, so that they can get to HW more quickly and start to see the game really shine. Please don't turn me into some sort of story-skip boogeyman in your head.

No, we do not know that, and there is no need for such a caveat due to the simple fact that ARR isn't a slog.



Actually it probably would be a quite big job - at least if they want to do a good job, which I am sure they would want to. There is not nearly as much "filler" content that can be easily cut in ARR as some people seem to believe.

I think you may be out of touch with how people besides yourself tend to feel about ARR.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...sts-is-tedious
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...of_filler_msq/
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ined_the_game/
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...the-main-story
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards...eborn/75584573
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards...eborn/75551044
https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion...ough-the-story
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ing_ffxiv_and/
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...about_to_quit/



I don't know why people so passionately resist the idea of improving something, or even admitting that something could be improved.

[Shurrikhan]

Well, don't take it the wrong way but if certain people are complaining about not being to just skip straight to endgame quickly, then this game probably is not for them.

"I don't suppose Minfilia could just tell us she wants over our linkpearl?" and "There sure are an awful lot of fetch-quests..." =/= "Give me endgame now!!!"

[Emmanellain]

Well, don't take it the wrong way but if certain people are complaining about not being to just skip straight to endgame quickly, then this game probably is not for them. The fact is, FFXIV is a FF game first and a MMO second, and FF games are always story focused, even the MMOs. Here normal MMO trappings of everything being about endgame raiding and stuff for 'shinez' and streetcred is only one part of the package (and is really only a minor part, if Yoshi's comments in the past about the amount of players really doing endgame content, let alone completing it, is any indication).

The story is an important part of that, and is meant to guide players gradually into the action, not just dumping everything into their lap at once and leaving it at that. Those who state that the game really is about endgame are sadly mistaken, and they're the ones who usually end up most disappointed and bored.

There is much more to this game than running Savage and Ultimate raids and trials. The game is a journey, not a spectacle, and the journey to get to endgame is just as important, if not more so, than the destination.

as a huge MSQ fan myself, i too see the importance of the story, but I really didn't need to sniff the chocobos and go to Coerthas to pick up leaves so Tataru could brew tea to calm the other scions before the move to Mor'dona.
The entire feast quest line could be shortened, along with other questlines that are more or less uninvolved with the plot.
I want to keep the development of our core cast as much as possible, but there is a lot of fat that can be trimmed, along with fixing the MSQ dungeons at the end of ARR.