Lack of End Game Content

[Lunavi]

I would argue ultimate has flopped, the mass majority of raiders do not even try it.



Issue is they added a fight that takes 100s of hours to clear... and you are rewarded with nothing but a glamour.

If SE adds time killers... and they rewards you with literally nothing but bragging rights and a shinny lvl 1 weapon basically... Then besides the epeen elitest (Which are not the majority of hardcore players) who the hell if going to waste time on them. Would be like a quest line that takes 75hrs to complete and you get a minion as a reward.

Isn’t this more proof that most people who run high end content actually does not want to But sees it as mandatory due to all relevant rewards being locked behind it? And wouldn’t designing a game in such manner to force people to do things they inheritly feels is a bother be poor game design?

I know there is such a thing as ”respecting ones time”, and to be fair, I like the current system as it promotes raiders to sell runs and be a more active part of the economy. However, if almost no one likes the system, why design the game in such a way that the only relevant progress you can do as battle classes is through said system that either demands a static or a boatload of time each week to play the PUG roulette until you hit a party of 7 people who can do the content?

I actually think that due to How expensive hard to get mounts are that people who actually enjoys the content would actually be HEAVILY inclined to grind savage, or maybe even untilate, for a mount.

[Nariel]

Isn’t this more proof that most people who run high end content actually does not want to But sees it as mandatory due to all relevant rewards being locked behind it? And wouldn’t designing a game in such manner to force people to do things they inheritly feels is a bother be poor game design?

I know there is such a thing as ”respecting ones time”, and to be fair, I like the current system as it promotes raiders to sell runs and be a more active part of the economy. However, if almost no one likes the system, why design the game in such a way that the only relevant progress you can do as battle classes is through said system that either demands a static or a boatload of time each week to play the PUG roulette until you hit a party of 7 people who can do the content?

I actually think that due to How expensive hard to get mounts are that people who actually enjoys the content would actually be HEAVILY inclined to grind savage, or maybe even untilate, for a mount.

No one like the system and still the game grow in number of active player.

You mean, like the one we already get on the 4th floor of every savage raids so far ?

[Avraym]

Let's say I wanted a tank ring from Alphascape, then. There's a 1/2 chance in getting it if it drops since you're rolling against another tank. Easy. Two chests drop, though, with a chance to drop any ring from any type, and let's assume that a ring will definitely drop, so 1/5. Your chances are then 1/10 to get a ring whatsoever, which are already worse odds than trying to go 1/8 for your ring in Edengate. Yoshida brought this up as well.

Q28:
Due to the loot changes in Eden (Savage), we're seeing disagreements between pickup groups over the loot. For someone like me without a static, I'm worried that I won't be able get any gear aside from exchange items. Do you have any plans to adjust the loot system?

A28:
On the other hand, there’s also the chance that you win all the loot, so it’s quite difficult. In terms of sheer probability, the current system should come out on top. I think it’s at least better than having items drop for a role no one plays, so I think for now I’d like to leave things as is.

"The current system should come out on top". You get just as many chests running it in a static, and statics are more likely to pass on loot they dont need. The current system favours you in a pug if you are lucky and still want other loot for your other classes. But no, it doesn't put you on top if you are gearing your main. Its very very basic math.

[SaberMaxwell]

Q28:
Due to the loot changes in Eden (Savage), we're seeing disagreements between pickup groups over the loot. For someone like me without a static, I'm worried that I won't be able get any gear aside from exchange items. Do you have any plans to adjust the loot system?

A28:
On the other hand, there’s also the chance that you win all the loot, so it’s quite difficult. In terms of sheer probability, the current system should come out on top. I think it’s at least better than having items drop for a role no one plays, so I think for now I’d like to leave things as is.

"The current system should come out on top". You get just as many chests running it in a static, and statics are more likely to pass on loot they dont need. The current system favours you in a pug if you are lucky and still want other loot for your other classes. But no, it doesn't put you on top if you are gearing your main. Its very very basic math.

The quote goes on:

"Also, regarding unlucky people who can't win rolls, if you were unlucky the gear for your job probably wouldn't have dropped anyway *laughs*"

I also detailed said "very basic math." Assuming a ring will always drop (it won't), you're fighting another tank for it (1/2) and there's a 1/5 chance the ring that drops will be a tank ring. In the 20% of scenarios the ring drops, 50% of those will result in your winning it...or a 10% (1/10) chance.

[Lunavi]

No one like the system and still the game grow in number of active player.

You mean, like the one we already get on the 4th floor of every savage raids so far ?

It was a point in response to people not doing ultimate content because there are no rewards behind it. I actually like the system as is, But if people do not run stuff, maybe it is because they do not enjoy running it? Eureka actually had great rewards, and still has, from a gil earning peespecrive, yet very few run it because they hate that piece of content, same with crafting. Crafting actually has very great rewards at the end of the road, still few does it.

Meanwhile, the jumping tower in the summer event has literally Zero rewards attached to it, and yet people STILL spend HOURS to get to the top of that tower for literally no return.

To make a point that BiS needs to be exclusively locked behind savage because otherwise there is no reason to it is a silly one to me. People will play content they like even if the rewards are just bragging rights. I do think it needs to be so for game economical reasons though as otherwise raiding would just eat of people’s resources through things like food and pots and crafted gear while never generating something back, but that is an entirely different topic.

[Avraym]

The quote goes on:

"Also, regarding unlucky people who can't win rolls, if you were unlucky the gear for your job probably wouldn't have dropped anyway *laughs*"

I also detailed said "very basic math." Assuming a ring will always drop (it won't), you're fighting another tank for it (1/2) and there's a 1/5 chance the ring that drops will be a tank ring. In the 20% of scenarios the ring drops, 50% of those will result in your winning it...or a 10% (1/10) chance.

Can we do the math for DPS mains now?

For example, I main Summoner. It is very unlikely there will be another Disiciple of Magic to compete with in the current ideal party format.

What are my chances then?

[Nora_of_Mira]

Can we do the math for DPS mains now?

For example, I main Summoner. It is very unlikely there will be another Disiciple of Magic to compete with in the current ideal party format.

What are my chances then?

from reddit:

dragonx254: Yeah you have to roll against 7 other people, but before, you might not have been able to roll at ALL because the piece that dropped wasn't for you.

With Fending, Maiming, Scouting, Striking, Aiming, Casting, Healing, you only had a 14% chance to even see a relevant gear piece drop. And then unless you are the only DPS of the same gear type, then you still have to roll against at least one other person. So your overall odds were 7%.

This is compared to the 12.5% guaranteed chance every week to get something.

Your odds have only improved.

[SaberMaxwell]

Can we do the math for DPS mains now?

Sure. If we're talking accessories:

Slaying: Between 1/5 and 1/10. NIN pending.
Aiming: Between 1/5 and 1/15 chance, NIN / double range pending (several people ran NIN/BRD/MCH).
Casting: 1/5, usually we don't see double caster.

Beyond that?
Striking: 1/7, possibly 1/14 depending if you're rolling against a SAM as a MNK. This is pug, this is possible.
Maiming: 1/7. DRG are special snowflakes who share gear with nobody.
Casting: 1/7. Again usually no double caster.
Aiming: 1/7 to 1/14; a lot of people ran double ranged.
Scouting: 1/7. Ninjas are special snowflakes.

[Avraym]

Why are ya'll bringing up the old raid loot system?

I never even said i prefered it lol.

Just that the current one is problematic (which it is).

All i said is that you will gear faster with a static than a pug with the current system (which you will).

[Nariel]

It was a point in response to people not doing ultimate content because there are no rewards behind it. I actually like the system as is, But if people do not run stuff, maybe it is because they do not enjoy running it? Eureka actually had great rewards, and still has, from a gil earning peespecrive, yet very few run it because they hate that piece of content, same with crafting. Crafting actually has very great rewards at the end of the road, still few does it.

Meanwhile, the jumping tower in the summer event has literally Zero rewards attached to it, and yet people STILL spend HOURS to get to the top of that tower for literally no return.

To make a point that BiS needs to be exclusively locked behind savage because otherwise there is no reason to it is a silly one to me. People will play content they like even if the rewards are just bragging rights. I do think it needs to be so for game economical reasons though as otherwise raiding would just eat of people’s resources through things like food and pots and crafted gear while never generating something back, but that is an entirely different topic.

Oh my bad then, maybe too much on the edge :b.

If the content is fun people will do it, I totaly advocate for this, even when the reward may seems clumsy. Just, recently how many people endure dozens of CT/LotA for barely visible namazu earring. Savage is nice as it is reward wise, challenging content that offer a bit better stuff is logic. I'm pretty satisfied with the reward overall, I don't like savage and don't miss the stuff, I can still farm mount unsynch later anyway. My only regret is the relic in eureka, that is something I can't bear and will fight to death to get it out.

Ultimate could use a mount that said, even a ridiculously one, bahamut mount, ultima mount is over the top but hey its an over the top challenge anyway.