Lack of End Game Content

[PandaMonium]

This is what gets me...I've seen this to a lesser extent with Savage as well. So, casuals claim there is so little interest from other people in endgame and yet... as is said here, the twitch viewers shoot up about tenfold when Ultimate comes out. Why is that, if raiders are a vanishing minority? Why is raiding still a big thing in WoW, the MMO that, despite declining numbers from its prime, still holds the most subs? People here keep acting as if adding some raid content would somehow be detrimental, but can someone tell me where all those interested Twitch viewers come from then if there's not people wanting to participate in these raids and see more of them?

Well, maybe because Twitch viewers are interested in watching a show? Fighting a raid boss is a show, a race for a World First is a show, no matter how many people in game are actually participating in said activity.
Doing the same trial x99 for a mount, farming 100500 resources to craft and make gil, decorating a house while 10 times rearranging the south wall - all these are not a show for the Twitch users, though still a very valuable activity for lots and lots FFXIV players.

[Zabuza]

Well, maybe because Twitch viewers are interested in watching a show? Fighting a raid boss is a show, a race for a World First is a show, no matter how many people in game are actually participating in said activity.
Doing the same trial x99 for a mount, farming 100500 resources to craft and make gil, decorating a house while 10 times rearranging the south wall - all these are not a show for the Twitch users, though still a very valuable activity for lots and lots FFXIV players.

And you don't think having a constant show on twitch with some interesting endgame activity to show could bring in more people to this game? Honestly, I think it could make this game more successful than it is. I don't know why casuals are so scared like using 5% more for raiding content is going to break their game.

[Misutoraru]

Well, maybe because Twitch viewers are interested in watching a show? Fighting a raid boss is a show, a race for a World First is a show, no matter how many people in game are actually participating in said activity.
Doing the same trial x99 for a mount, farming 100500 resources to craft and make gil, decorating a house while 10 times rearranging the south wall - all these are not a show for the Twitch users, though still a very valuable activity for lots and lots FFXIV players.

This, I sub to quite a few YouTube channel keep watching their walkthrough, but never have the intention to buy or play that game.
Some people just have a very busy life and enjoy watching

[ApolloGenX]

No, I think they intend for casuals to cancel and the resub later when there is more content....

[Xatsh]

No, I think they intend for casuals to cancel and the resub later when there is more content....

Casuals are not the ones running out of content. Game has tons of stuff for the casual crowd, more so then most mmos.

[Catwho]

The 98 pages of threads have taught me one thing: The debate is not really "casuals" vs "hardcore." Since by their own admission, the "hardcore" people are the ones that run out of content first and either unsub or go play another game while they wait.

It's "raiders who only like challenging endgame battle content" vs "completionists who enjoy PvE timesinks."

I guarantee you that the PvE timesink people are the ones who generate more money for SE (due to constant Mogstation infusions and paying for 10 retainers to hold all their stuff), who have more hours logged (I apparently hit 700 days recently), and who probably have more accomplishments in the game, even if those accomplishments don't include UWU, a Feast ranking, or a world first savage win.

Once again, though: I think the raiders do deserve more content. Due to the nature of software development, adding that content is not easy because they cannot clone experienced battle content programmers, and sometimes they can't even hire them for any price. But if SE has to prioritize one thing, taking into account the iron triangle of software development, I'm okay with raiding being the one thing that gets some extra love. Twelve knows I've still got plenty of other things to do.

Just don't call me a "casual" as an insult because I choose to spend my 30 hours a week in this game fishing or leveling up alternative jobs or grinding out of date anima weapons for the achievements.

[Arcari]

And you don't think having a constant show on twitch with some interesting endgame activity to show could bring in more people to this game? Honestly, I think it could make this game more successful than it is. I don't know why casuals are so scared like using 5% more for raiding content is going to break their game.

And there's your problem.

"Constant."

Devs are humans too, you know. There's only so much they can do at any given time. Not to mention the level of experience required. I believe Yoshida has mentioned that out of his entire battle design team, only 3 of them are even capable of making Ultimate-level fights? And of course, that's not for lack of trying to get more designers (they're constantly looking for more staff).

I wonder if we'll get three Ultimates for ShB. It sounds like Yoshida would be willing to try it, but of course, it's an eternal battle of resources.

As an aside out of curiosity, what would people prefer to have if given the choice: two more bosses added to Normal/Savage raid tiers, or one more Ultimate boss per expansion?

[MonteCristo]

The 98 pages of threads have taught me one thing: The debate is not really "casuals" vs "hardcore." Since by their own admission, the "hardcore" people are the ones that run out of content first and either unsub or go play another game while they wait.

It's "raiders who only like challenging endgame battle content" vs "completionists who enjoy PvE timesinks."

I guarantee you that the PvE timesink people are the ones who generate more money for SE (due to constant Mogstation infusions and paying for 10 retainers to hold all their stuff), who have more hours logged (I apparently hit 700 days recently), and who probably have more accomplishments in the game, even if those accomplishments don't include UWU, a Feast ranking, or a world first savage win.

Once again, though: I think the raiders do deserve more content. Due to the nature of software development, adding that content is not easy because they cannot clone experienced battle content programmers, and sometimes they can't even hire them for any price. But if SE has to prioritize one thing, taking into account the iron triangle of software development, I'm okay with raiding being the one thing that gets some extra love. Twelve knows I've still got plenty of other things to do.

Just don't call me a "casual" as an insult because I choose to spend my 30 hours a week in this game fishing or leveling up alternative jobs or grinding out of date anima weapons for the achievements.

Standing ovation

[Avraym]

The 98 pages of threads have taught me one thing: The debate is not really "casuals" vs "hardcore." Since by their own admission, the "hardcore" people are the ones that run out of content first and either unsub or go play another game while they wait.

It's "raiders who only like challenging endgame battle content" vs "completionists who enjoy PvE timesinks."

I guarantee you that the PvE timesink people are the ones who generate more money for SE (due to constant Mogstation infusions and paying for 10 retainers to hold all their stuff), who have more hours logged (I apparently hit 700 days recently), and who probably have more accomplishments in the game, even if those accomplishments don't include UWU, a Feast ranking, or a world first savage win.

Once again, though: I think the raiders do deserve more content. Due to the nature of software development, adding that content is not easy because they cannot clone experienced battle content programmers, and sometimes they can't even hire them for any price. But if SE has to prioritize one thing, taking into account the iron triangle of software development, I'm okay with raiding being the one thing that gets some extra love. Twelve knows I've still got plenty of other things to do.

Just don't call me a "casual" as an insult because I choose to spend my 30 hours a week in this game fishing or leveling up alternative jobs or grinding out of date anima weapons for the achievements.

I think your observation is fair. I don't understand elitist people using casual as an insult term either.

A lot of players, simply prefer less challenging, more time sink orientated gameplay and I think that's perfectly fine, especially given a lot of them only play "x" amount of hours a week.

But I personally consider myself a mixture of both a "raider who only like challenging endgame battle content" and a "completionist who enjoy PvE timesinks."

I'll usually unlock most/all side content, max all classes, make the most out of my dailies/weeklies.

I still enjoy it - but find myself quickly running out of reasons to do endgame battle content (given how little there is and how quickly you can achieve what you need with what we have).

The game certainly does a better job at sating the PvE timeskink rather than end game battle content.

[Adventica6]

Complete all the content in the game, with screenshots, then come back here, not before.