Lack of End Game Content

[SaberMaxwell]

I mean, it's literally one fight per tier. Not much in actual content but difficulty, for sure.

It's one fight, yeah, but the difficulty gives it longevity. Progging it, like I said, can take upwards of months; assuming one raids an average of 30 hours a week, their average kill would be five weeks in (based on the average 150h measure). That's a huge amount of time to raid per week, as well, a lot don't raid 30 hours a week.

It just feels more like Ultimate is being suggested as a way of 'how can we get him to stop posting.' Hoping I'll get into it and then forget this thread exists...Maybe you're actually trying to help me.

I'm hoping that you get into it and enjoy the content so much you do forget this thread. The only caveat is that if you do get the taste for Ultimate, even Savage slows down to a crawl in comparison, so watch out for that :P

Either way, I don't feel that people should need to clear both Ultimates before they can comment on endgame, because then only 1% of people are allowed to say anything about endgame?

That's a fair criticism. For what it's worth, you are allowed to comment (I certainly can't and won't stop you); my stance from the beginning was "I wouldn't mind more, but I'm fine with what we have although I am biased because I do enjoy the content cycle of Extreme to Savage to Ultimate." Savage is a progression raid, Ultimate is not, so they can make Ultimate in a much more precise way both mechanically and with regards to stat checks, because it can be tuned for exact item levels rather than approximations by the developers.

These standards don't apply to anything else in the game. We don't ask people to collect every mount before they suggest an idea for another type of mount they think would be cool...

The problem here is, asking someone to do Ultimate isn't the same as asking them "to do everything." Nobody cares if you go back and complete The Soul of the Creator (Savage); nobody cares if you go complete The Second Coil of Bahamut Turn 4. Nobody's declaring you need a 100% raid portfolio across every expansion in order to have credentials. In the current content cycle, Ultimate is the zenith; it's the end. The omega to Savage's alpha. Both Ultimates remain relevant today because they can't be unsynched, and their rewards are likewise still very prestigious. That's a lot of staying power for this MMO especially, considering the content is over a year old now.

Most raiders I know consider Ultimate to be just as relevant endgame as current Savage.

I also guarantee you a lot of people feeling that there is a void of endgame and unsubbing are not people who have cleared Ultimate.

If enough are abandoning Savage to be statistically significant, I'm sure Square Enix will change their formula. I'm sure that's one of the reasons they came up with Ultimate in the first place as well; a nice compromise between people who liked Gordias difficulty and people who liked gear progression.

[HyoMinPark]

I mean, it's literally one fight per tier. Not much in actual content but difficulty, for sure.

It’s one fight that is more challenging and carries more weight than the four you are progressing through currently. And it certainly took the best players in the game longer to clear than any Savage tier since Midas (UCoB took about 13 days; UwU took about 6 days—for comparison, Creator took about 36 hours; Deltascape, Sigmascape, and Alphascape took about 18 hours; and Eden took less than that).

Shrugging off Ultimate because “it’s just one fight” isn’t really a decent excuse not to acknowledge the content.

[linay]

There was a podcast I saw recently where some people said that they wouldn't mind if there was no Ultimate and instead Savage content lasts longer. Some wanted Midas difficulty (if not Gordias) and maybe more bosses.

[Arngrim_Greyashe]

It's fine. I expect nothing less than complete hostility from your side at this point. I just find it amusing that I'm being painted as the aggressor.



I acknowledged its difficulty.

At this point you're just painting a picture of yourself with a victim complex.

[Zabuza]

At this point you're just painting a picture of yourself with a victim complex.

I mean, when people literally tell you to leave. Whatever though, you're right. No one is being hostile towards me at allllll. I'm just telling you I'm not the aggressor and that my defense has been justified, given the disrespect with which I have been treated over this thread. I honestly feel it is a microcosm towards how raiders in general are seen as in this game. But I should just stay silent and take the punches right? Honestly, what would you have me do?

[Arngrim_Greyashe]

I mean, when people literally tell you to leave. Whatever though, you're right. No one is being hostile towards me at allllll. I'm just telling you I'm not the aggressor and that my defense has been justified, given the disrespect with which I have been treated over this thread. I honestly feel it is a microcosm towards how raiders in general are seen as in this game. But I should just stay silent and take the punches right? Honestly, what would you have me do?

You're ignoring constructive feedback in order to continue arguing. At this point, it is all on you. You're playing the victim when people are trying to give you actual feedback and saying you're being attacked.

[Zabuza]

You're ignoring constructive feedback in order to continue arguing. At this point, it is all on you. You're playing the victim when people are trying to give you actual feedback and saying you're being attacked.

Sorry, but I don't consider 'leave the game' constructive feedback. Anyways, I'm fatigued. For some reason people want to apply a unique standard to endgame to where only someone who has done 100% can say anything about endgame. So that means 1% of people since there is one actual hard fight in the game per tier(Ultimate). That is a good way to ensure that the endgame scene will never improve if no one can ever offer suggestions for it. We do not tell people that they cannot offer suggestions for mounts if they have not collected every mount. You guys keep applying that type of standard here, however. It is hypocritical. Anyways, I probably will try Ultimate later on. Otherwise, I'm done with this argument unless someone has something new to add. I'm just...tired.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Sorry, but I don't consider 'leave the game' constructive feedback. Anyways, I'm fatigued. For some reason people want to apply a unique standard to endgame to where only someone who has done 100% can say anything about endgame. So that means 1% of people since there is one actual hard fight in the game per tier(Ultimate). That is a good way to ensure that the endgame scene will never improve if no one can ever offer suggestions for it. We do not tell people that they cannot offer suggestions for mounts if they have not collected every mount. You guys keep applying that type of standard here, however. It is hypocritical. Anyways, I probably will try Ultimate later on. Otherwise, I'm done with this argument unless someone has something new to add. I'm just...tired.

You're tired because you keep misconstruing the argument and people don't let on.
Look at what you're saying. You're saying that others are saying you need to complete Ultimate to say anything about endgame.
Yet you're complaining about lack of endgame... while not having cleared all of the available endgame. You're asking for more food and your plate isn't empty yet.

[Zabuza]

You're tired because you keep misconstruing the argument and people don't let on.
Look at what you're saying. You're saying that others are saying you need to complete Ultimate to say anything about endgame.
Yet you're complaining about lack of endgame... while not having cleared all of the available endgame. You're asking for more food and your plate isn't empty yet.

Yet people ask for new mounts and glamour all the time without having obtained all mounts and glamour. You don't see the clear double standard. Please tell me why it's okay for that but not this.

The forum is already a tiny minority of the game, and you guys want to stifle ideas further by saying only those who have cleared Ultimate(1%) can discuss endgame. So basically, 1% of 1% are allowed to discuss endgame. That's absurd.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Yet people ask for new mounts and glamour all the time without having obtained all mounts and glamour. You don't see the clear double standard. Please tell me why it's okay for that but not this.

The forum is already a tiny minority of the game, and you guys want to stifle ideas further by saying only those who have cleared Ultimate(1%) can discuss endgame. So basically, 1% of 1% are allowed to discuss endgame. That's absurd.

Wanting a particular mount =/= wanting more mounts in general. I'm allowed to ask for a particular kind of mount because it's my personal taste. But it would be hypocritical of me to ask 50 more mounts while not having collected all of them. Kinda like asking for more endgame without having cleared Ultimate.

Clear Ultimate first, then you'll truly be out of endgame to do and you can legitimately complain. Right now, your claim that you don't have anymore endgame to do is a lie. You still have Ultimate.