Dark Knight: 5.0x Feedback Thread

[shao32]

I consider you don't have any idea/experience on how HW DRK use to work on what you say, or probably you was bad playing it, no offense.

But claiming this version have more sinergy between skills, more resource management witch is false since the MP generation is much more inconsistent that HW and SB and now DRK is more anti-magic is something with all respect a ignorant will claim, specially the anti-magic part since HW DRK was know to mitigate magic better that the other 2, actually dark mind is weaker that SB so it's less anti-magic tank now.

You find the old mechanics uninteresting or to hard or no rewarding probably bcs you didn't know how they work properly it's fine but don't claim HW have inexistent lacks and problems when the job was face to face against HW WAR on damage, was literally immortal in dungeon pulls and utility was way much more impactfully than now, miss you reprisal.

BTW you gain around 4 use of edge/flood each min so you don't use never TBN to storage a dark arts for darkside, the only purpose of the proc right now is increase the amount of edge you can land on trick attack, if you have to plan the uses of edge and TBN bcs darkside you are playing the job wrong.

[Absimiliard]

But claiming this version have more sinergy between skills

Uhhhh. You do realize DRK's original design had so little synergy that one of the most common complaints about it was that it basically worked against itself, yes? It would still perform quite well in magic-heavy fights, but the play style itself put a ton of people off from wanting to play it.

[shao32]

Uhhhh. You do realize DRK's original design had so little synergy that one of the most common complaints about it was that it basically worked against itself, yes? It would still perform quite well in magic-heavy fights, but the play style itself put a ton of people off from wanting to play it.

What are you talking about? HW DRK kit and gameplay have a lot of sinergy, skills buffing skills and dinamic GCD and MP spenders thanks to that, only the parry mechanics/blood price work against the evasion/blind buffs that are for some situations and still they didn't meant to be use at the same time since you can use blood price and get a lot of mp and abyssal drain uses and then a lot of dogges if the pull was still alive on the down time.

Only put off ppl that want to be a 1-2-3 tank like in ARR, DRK was complex compared to the other 2 and that was part of the fun.

[LichKaiser]

...

ok now i see, just another fan boy of HW DK who just dont lissen and wanna talk, speaking of what he think is good.
I proved many times how good is actual DK compared old HW DK, no need more. Care none of your opinions, feel more you have no idea of what are you talking about, did my 1st kills at that time, soo probably i have more experience of you on HW DK. Im happy they changed the kit, it was shit. now need to tweak the actual kit and nothing alse.
No offese but i ll not use more of my time to reply to a wall like you, who doesnt wanna lissen and just wanna impose his own idea with little facts that in most cases can easily beated like i did. I am here to say my feed back on 5.0 DK, and thats it

- rework Living Dead or give better interaction, i saw solid ideas till now
- better AoE "pull to pull" mitigation or regeneration
- Salted earth anti-synergy with actual kit. add some tool, rework it or just change it with another spell

[shao32]

ok now i see, just another fan boy of HW DK who just dont lissen and wanna talk, speaking of what he think is good.
I proved many times how good is actual DK compared old HW DK, no need more. Care none of your opinions, feel more you have no idea of what are you talking about, did my 1st kills at that time, soo probably i have more experience of you on HW DK. Im happy they changed the kit, it was shit. now need to tweak the actual kit and nothing alse.
No offese but i ll not use more of my time to reply to a wall like you, who doesnt wanna lissen and just wanna impose his own idea with little facts that in most cases can easily beated like i did. I am here to say my feed back on 5.0 DK, and thats it

- rework Living Dead or give better interaction, i saw solid ideas till now
- better AoE "pull to pull" mitigation or regeneration
- Salted earth anti-synergy with actual kit. add some tool, rework it or just change it with another spell

the only thing you prove is DRK now is way more simple aka = better for you, i respect anyone that preffer simple jobs but that doesn't mean complex ones are = to bad, DRK in the past prove to work beatutiful well and it was fun except you are bad at it, yes DRK never was perfect but you overexagerating his problem with other problems that could be solved by playing the job properly. DRK use to be strong and fun if you find it clunky bcs you wasn't unable to manage the job properly it was your problem.

i have no problem on healty conversation about old interactions of the job but if you say im not listen and im a fanboy when i tried to explain why you are wrong and using my personal experience over 4 years maining it, if im a old fanboy that make you a DRK hater by the same logic, remeber every feedback made in the past was made to make DRK more like in HW bcs ppl like HW DRK keep that in mind.

[Seku]

Uhhhh. You do realize DRK's original design had so little synergy that one of the most common complaints about it was that it basically worked against itself, yes? It would still perform quite well in magic-heavy fights, but the play style itself put a ton of people off from wanting to play it.

Dark Knight did have synergy when it first released. It put INT down up which basically kicked monk out of the raid Meta.

It was also arguably the best Main tank due to Low Blow damage procts and had some of the best Tank Buster mitigation due to the fact that most Tank busters were magic based at the time, which kicked PLD at the time out of the meta.

The only thing that was off was Dark Arts Dark Passenger + Blood price, due to the blind effect forcing mobs to miss you or if you by chance got a white mage that used Holy to stun the mobs.

The simple fix would have of course just been to do what they did with it now. Which is to allow for Blood weapon to be used in and out of Tank stance and have given it the added bonus of restoring MP per enemy hit while keeping it's same value for mp restore. It's not like Dark Knights where hurting for MP any how due to the fact that larger pulls would keep them full and thus allow for them to spam abyssal drain with Dark Arts to keep themselves up permanently, assuming no WHM with Holy.

As for how I think they should go about doing with Dark Knight this expansion though.

1. Lower the cost of the TBN to like half of a Edge / Flood of Shadow and extend the duration of the shield by like 3 seconds. This will be a small reward for people playing the class right as then you will then be in a DPS gained situation as a reward for having the shield burst and mitigating damage, and bring back some of the "Hit me and I hit you back" game play.
2. Lower the Recast time of Abyssal Drain to like 30-45 seconds.
3. Allow for the second hit on our AoE combo to restore a small amount of HP per hit.
4. Get rid of the nerf to Dark Mind, maybe up it's mitigation due to it only stopping Magic Damage. I think the same should be done with RI on warrior. Or make it so that they both just block both damage types.
5. Raise Dark Missonary's aoe magic reduction up to 20%. No reason why it should be lower than PLD's passage of arms.

I would make more suggestions about re-working some skills and bringing back old ones. Maybe putting in some actual traditional Dark Knight themed effects / abilities. But let's be honest, DRK isn't SE's dream child WAR. And before they fix DRK, their probably going to fix WAR and leave DRK in the dust....again.

[Absimiliard]

1. Lower the cost of the TBN to like half of a Edge / Flood of Shadow and extend the duration of the shield by like 3 seconds. This will be a small reward for people playing the class right as then you will then be in a DPS gained situation as a reward for having the shield burst and mitigating damage, and bring back some of the "Hit me and I hit you back" game play.
2. Lower the Recast time of Abyssal Drain to like 30-45 seconds.
3. Allow for the second hit on our AoE combo to restore a small amount of HP per hit.
4. Get rid of the nerf to Dark Mind, maybe up it's mitigation due to it only stopping Magic Damage. I think the same should be done with RI on warrior. Or make it so that they both just block both damage types.
5. Raise Dark Missonary's aoe magic reduction up to 20%. No reason why it should be lower than PLD's passage of arms.

I would make more suggestions about re-working some skills and bringing back old ones. Maybe putting in some actual traditional Dark Knight themed effects / abilities. But let's be honest, DRK isn't SE's dream child WAR. And before they fix DRK, their probably going to fix WAR and leave DRK in the dust....again.

TBN is already more than powerful enough. Gear scaling causes it to suffer a bit in non-savage content, but in savage it is working just fine. Mind you I would love it if they halved its MP cost, but the ability really is good as-is. Halving its MP cost would probably require them to nerf something else in our kit, which we really can't afford.

Abyssal Drain is a bad ability with how tank self-sustain is currently set up. A lower CD would be nice, but I don't see them doing it. Its current CD lines up with GNB's Aurora. That said, I could see them maybe making the healing aspect of it stronger. Right now AB's heal is pitiful unless you've got a ton of mobs on you, yeah? Well, maybe giving it a set potency (a bit less than clemency due to AB not costing resource/DPS) and no increased healing on larger groups instead of a shorter CD would work. Its damage component is already fine for something with zero cost and a heal attached.

Getting back a smidge more MP would probably be more beneficial in the long run than having a bootleg Brutal Shell heal attached, though I would love to have more self-healing on DRK either way. Has the worst self-sustain out of all the tanks right now, doesn't it? I'm still debating between DRK and GNB on that one

Definitely agree about Dark Mind. Or, if they're unwilling to return its mitigation to what it was before, they could lower the cooldown instead. 90 seconds is unreasonable for such a weak and circumstantial ability.

Dark Missionary is currently a slightly inferior version of GNB's Heart of Light. Their effects are the same, I grant you, but GNB gains access to theirs a full twelve levels earlier. I would love to see it made stronger, but the fact that GNB shares the exact same ability is going to interfere with convincing them to do that. Buffing one would likely necessitate buffing the other to avoid the online equivalent of a riot.

And warrior? Well, can't really argue with that one either. We'll probably end up seeing the warrior-god-of-tanks trope on full display again before too long. WAR and DRK are currently relatively well balanced; WAR has slightly stronger DPS normally, while DRK surpasses it when given the correct set of raid buffs. The one thing WAR does not currently have an answer to is TBN, and I hope they never do get something comparable.

[Shurrikhan]

1. Lower the cost of the TBN to like half of a Edge / Flood of Shadow and extend the duration of the shield by like 3 seconds. This will be a small reward for people playing the class right as then you will then be in a DPS gained situation as a reward for having the shield burst and mitigating damage, and bring back some of the "Hit me and I hit you back" game play.
2. Lower the Recast time of Abyssal Drain to like 30-45 seconds.
3. Allow for the second hit on our AoE combo to restore a small amount of HP per hit.
4. Get rid of the nerf to Dark Mind, maybe up it's mitigation due to it only stopping Magic Damage. I think the same should be done with RI on warrior. Or make it so that they both just block both damage types.
5. Raise Dark Missonary's aoe magic reduction up to 20%. No reason why it should be lower than PLD's passage of arms.

1. That would remove any risk to arguably the most powerful mitigation/sustain-over-time CD in the game outside of Nascent Flash-Chaotic Cyclone-Chaotic Cyclone-Decimate-Decimate on trash.
2. That's fine, actually.
3. Why? You just gave that over to Abyssal Drain, and Stalwart Soul is already powerful enough to make Quietus painfully situational in trash where you can make use of TBN on CD.
4. RI blocks all damage. Camouflage is the only other typal mitigation, via parry, but even it has a universal mitigation component to an average total of 15% mitigation. RI, like Shelltron, are also not equivalents to DM. Their slot equivalents are effectively Thrill of Battle on Warrior and non-existent (replaced by base block chance) on Paladin.
5. Passage of Arms is a longer CD which costs the PLD its movement, any further mitigation opportunities, and its uptime -- in many ways the most punishing CD in the game if used outside of jump phases, especially given that the buff can still be slow to apply to higher-latency party members, making it difficult to reliably weave. There is absolutely no way DRK should have something stronger than that, "anti-magic" tank or no.

[Deceptus]

1. That would remove any risk to arguably the most powerful mitigation/sustain-over-time CD in the game outside of Nascent Flash-Chaotic Cyclone-Chaotic Cyclone-Decimate-Decimate on trash.

Curious how you're putting 4 GCD's (lets be generous and say 2.35s) in a 6 second window?

[Kabooa]

Curious how you're putting 4 GCD's (lets be generous and say 2.35s) in a 6 second window?

0 latency.

-.5 for the ability activation, first gcd at 5.5, 3.0, .5

Edit: Hoooo, i mussed there.