Dark Knight: 5.0x Feedback Thread

[Chrono_Rising]

You seem to be making a very big assumptions about whether or not blocking strength will get to 25% especially considering that they purposely nerfed it this expansion. Based on what my pld co-tank was telling me after he got to 80 and what I'm seeing at 76, we went up 1% from 19% to 20% at ilv 400 to 450. Sheltron will still need another 5% just equal TBN. Further more you don't appear to be considering that TBN scales with our HP. How much did our HP raise during thos 50 ilvs?

We also went up 10% last expansion, yes it is an assumption but not a critical one as I stated later: even at 21% you can find such points at which Sheltron begins breaking away from TBN.

Looking at your math, you are going ahead and applying your, assumption that Sheltron will be at 25 %. The fact of the matter is that we don't have enough evidence to say that this will happen in this expansion much less at all. Until that happens tho you'd have to take lethal levels of dmg to equal TBN's mitigation.

You proposed 25% I accepted. 21, 22, 23, 24% also have examples of similar math, 25% just happens to be cleaner. I also pointed this out in my reply to you. Are you intentionally ignoring facts that don't support your opinion?

Regarding combining CDs, I'll be honest, I don't actually know how TBN reacts with other % based mitigation like Rampart. Is TBN's mitigation applied first and then the remaining damage is reduced by the % or is the overall damage reduced and then TBN reduces that. Depending on this, using the 125k dmg @ 100k hp example you'd either be reducing the dmg by 55k or 62.5k.

Which points to why you are missing another point that I made: buster and follow up damage can now both be caught by a single use of sheltron. UwU Titan provides a nice clean example in which you take a 12k auto, 40k cleave, and 120k buster in the span of a few seconds. I we imagine such mechanics at level 80 you can see where this goes. You must be healed between these hits; at 100k TBN mitigates 25k Sheltron on its own will now mitigate 34.4k at 20%. Hard hitting tank buster +follow up damage in which you need to be healed gives the potential for a 20% mitigation over a duration to outweigh a single shield even if it as as strong at 25% of max HP. UwU Ifrit if you choose to mitigate through the buster Sheltron will now catch both busters, not just one though most people just invuln through this.

You said that Drk is squishier, which implies that it is squishy at all is my point. My comment was that it was the only tank, at least to me that didn't feel squishy at all.

This is not an implication it is an assumption the reader is making. Saying I make less money than someone doesn't mean I'm poor. Saying I make more money than someone else doesn't make me rich. I drew a relative experience to how I am experiencing other tanks, which you need to know in order to make your implication.

Regarding HG, I guess I did forget about one easy pull every 7 min.

I included Soul Eater for the same reason that I included Clemency. It is a thing that goes towards survivability that you shouldn't be using under normal circumstances.

First off, our context it a trash pull; where many enemies are hitting you. You aren't really claiming that Soul Eater is keeping you alive in anything that remotely resembles clemency are you? A 3 GCD wind up to a 5k heal compared to 1 GCD 25k heal.

If you are having to use it then either the healer is bad, the dps are slow, or you didn't rotate your CDs properly.

I have had pulls take so long my original rampart has come back. I use pf for dungeons. Yes, at times I have to clemency myself to live because nothing else is up. And then I adjust my pull size.

Looking at your rather silly example to Xiaoki, I just checked your work. Sheltron isn't going to save you in your scenario either. Why? With your example we are still at 100k max hp, based on the TBN number you used. If we are taking 50k every 3 seconds then Sheltron is only stopping 10k every 3 seconds meaning that you are taking 40k unmitigated every 3 seconds. This means your party has 6 seconds to DRASTICALLY reduce the amount of dmg that you are taking or even with Sheltron mitigating more dmg you won't live through 120k of dmg in 9 seconds.

Or I have time to pop additional cooldowns? For example my Camo on gnb, Nascent flash on warrior, clemency myself on pld, pop rampart, and oh yeah be healed; use self heals all while my first mitigation is still active. What if I am doing this at the end of my pull where things will start dying and I just need to hang on for a few more seconds. Seems like I can do this.

I don't always do math, but when I do, I always check my work.
Stay mathematical my friends.

You've barely addressed the points raised against you; you failed to consider common tanking mechanics; and drew bad conclusions based on surface examples with admittedly little context.

Once again I am not saying that TBN has absolutely no use: it is still extremely strong; and has better uses than other tanks in multiple examples. But it isn't always the best option: and since we lack a back up in physical damage heavy areas I am specifically pointing this out because our other mitigation Dark Mind is not helping us here. If you find yourself in a critical situation when encountering physical damage where rampart and shadow wall are down: TBN will not buy you alot of time; it is ok for it not to be an answer to everything: but we lack an answer because dark mind is magic only damage. Thrill is always useful, Camo always useful, Clemency useful when needed.

If I wanted to rip into TBN I would talk about the fact that it is stil risk without reward as it was in Stormblood and continues to be in in shadowbringers. It does have drawbacks: It is risk without reward, it isn'tas strong as % mitigation over a duration for sustained high damage in the form of things like Ahk morn where 20% mitigation will get you more (which an example of where Dark mind is powerful but now imagine a physical version like in a7s); and is bad against fluff damage which we still lack a sufficent answer to unless you can time it with high precision.