Dark Knight: 5.0x Feedback Thread

[Lyth]

Basically, whatever puts us in line with whoever is in second place. I don't want to be the highest damage tank, I just want to be in range of them.

[RyuDragnier]

Basically, whatever puts us in line with whoever is in second place. I don't want to be the highest damage tank, I just want to be in range of them.

We should have been there to begin with. The damage listings should have WAR at the top, then DRK, then GNB, then PLD. Right now it's reversed for some weird reason.

[Jandor]

We should have been there to begin with. The damage listings should have WAR at the top, then DRK, then GNB, then PLD. Right now it's reversed for some weird reason.

Why should WAR be higher than DRK?

They're not harder to play, don't seem to be bring notably less party utility, and the berserker archetype lore goes both ways tbh. Inner beast vs. inner darkness.

[RyuDragnier]

Why should WAR be higher than DRK?

They're not harder to play, don't seem to be bring notably less party utility, and the berserker archetype lore goes both ways tbh. Inner beast vs. inner darkness.

Let's look at Utility.

PLD has Cover, allowing it to take all damage another party member will get for the next 12s. It has Divine Veil, which gives a 10% max HP shield to all party members within 15 yalms of you when you're healed. It has Clemency, a 1200 potency heal it can use on anybody. It has Intervention, allowing it to reduce damage of a party member by 10% or more depending on whether or not you have Rampart/Sentinel up. Finally, it has Passage of Arms, giving themselves a guaranteed block while it's up and everybody behind them gets a 15% damage reduction. That's 5 utility skills, and it's currently doing the most damage.

GNB has Aurora, a HoT regen it can throw on anybody. It has Heart of Light, a 10% magic damage reduction to the party. It has Heart of Stone, reducing damage taken by 15% for whoever you throw it on. That's 3 utility skills, and is the 2nd highest DPS.

DRK has The Blackest Night, which puts on a 25% max HP shield on whoever it's thrown on. It has Dark Missionary, which is a 10% magic damage reduction for the party. That's only 2 utility skills, and so this one should be looked at for doing more damage because it doesn't have much utility at all, and is the 3rd place damage.

WAR has Shake It Off, a 12% max HP shield for the party that can be buffed up to 18% if you have Thrill of Battle, Vengeance, and Raw Intuition up when you use it. It has Nascent Flash, which reduces damage of target party member by 10% and heals them for half of the damage you take while it's up. That's 2 utility skills, it's currently the LOWEST DPS of the tanks, and is definitely in need of a damage buff.

You see the problem? Tanks with more utility are doing more damage than tanks that have barely any utility. That's backwards logic, and so DPS changes are needed for the tanks. Though rather than nerf PLD and GNB damage, I'd prefer if they just buffed DRK and WAR damage. Though in terms of where the placing of DRK and WAR damage should be when compared to each other, I'd prefer if they were equal or really close to each other. But let's be honest, DRK should probably be the top damage since Dark Missionary is heavily situational due to it being only magic damage reduction, meaning some fights like E4 it's completely useless in (I'm fairly certain all the damage in that fight is physical).

[Chrono_Rising]

Though in terms of where the placing of DRK and WAR damage should be when compared to each other, I'd prefer if they were equal or really close to each other. But let's be honest, DRK should probably be the top damage since Dark Missionary is heavily situational due to it being only magic damage reduction, meaning some fights like E4 it's completely useless in (I'm fairly certain all the damage in that fight is physical).

I actually don't think he was wondering why you think the order of tank dps was wrong, I think he just means why does Warrior have to be top dps here? I think you kinda came to the opposite conclusion as well in this post ending with either really close or dark knight higher since dark missionary is more situational and nascent flash may not mitigate as much as TBN but it can restore a huge amount of HP.

On that note I would like to see Nascent flash buffed to heal the warrior and target for the same or nearly the same amount of HP.

[DRKoftheAzure]

Not having Dark Passenger at level 40 feels really bad especially when leveling and you get a level 40-50 dungeon...

[Kabooa]

Not having Dark Passenger at level 40 feels really bad especially when leveling and you get a level 40-50 dungeon...

You literally get Flood of Darkness at level 30. It's the same skill.

[Absimiliard]

I've been doing a tremendous amount of experimenting with the various tanks at all tiers of play; different level brackets (via level sync), all raid content (current and former), every trial at all available levels, etc. My results, while not entirely surprising to me, do leave me to wonder if it isn't intentional on some level. DRK got one or two tiers in Heavensward where it got to be good, and it's ranged from mediocre to outright inferior in virtually all other circumstances.

Needing to sacrifice DPS for increased mitigation (looking at you, TBN) is problematic to say the least, especially with the heavy focus on damage output tanks are expected to maintain throughout their careers. This is worsened by DRK's seeming complete lack of utility outside of an option that blows an unreasonable amount of MP (again, TBN) and Dark Missionary. Granted, Dark Missionary is pretty good, but Gunbreaker gets the same cooldown significantly earlier. These issues - lack of utility, need to sacrifice damage for mitigation, slow gameplay, overall mediocre defenses, and generally poor DPS compared to the other tanks - make DRK a generally poor choice in all tiers of content. While viable, playing it is a disservice to your team when you could be bringing much more to the table as a GNB or PLD--or WAR, for that matter.

tl;dr: DRK doesn't do anywhere near enough damage to justify its lack of utility and average defensive ability.

[DRKoftheAzure]

My 1st personal most hated ability;


Living Shadow, it's basically pet that does it's own thing with each hit being 400 and it has it's own rotation(yes the it's Abyssal Drain, Quietus, and Flood of Shadow do work as AoEs) which leads into my 2nd personal most hated ability;


Delirium, MP regen on it sucks for single target if using Bloodspiller but okay if using Quietus in single target, which leads into my 3rd personal most hated ability;


Blood Weapon, it just feels bad to use since all it does is barely give you MP back and is used for Living Shadow.


Now for the personal "meh" abilities; Edge/Flood of Darkness/Shadow, on paper these okay skills but because Darkside is now tied to these skills, it's very "meh" honestly, Bloodspiller and Quietus were nice in Stormblood but have outlived their novelty and are just Fell Cleave/Decimate clones basically, Carve and Spit animation is way too long for it too be oGCD but it looks so cool and I do wish it's potency was at least 200 higher...


And now my suggestions on how to fix DRK in 5.2-5.3 if DRK doesn't get anything for 5.1;


Shadowskin is put back into the game for DRK at level 4, but only provides a 10% HP shield and is GCD, which upgrades into The Blackest Night at level 70 .


Blood Weapon is obtained at level 18, and at level 35 they get Blood Price as a trait which restores HP on hit for Blood weapon and creates a barrier which nullifies damage equaling HP restored for both Blood Weapon and Souleater.


Edge/Flood of Darkness remain as they are but Darkside is its own separate button again and you also get Edge/Flood of Shadow at the same level along with Quietus, Abyssal Drain, Bloodspiller, and Carve and Spit, although Edge/Flood of Darkness becomes Shadow when you have 50 blood gauge and you can use Bloodspiller/Quietus if you used Edge/Flood of Shadow, and can only use Carve and Spit/Abyssal Drain if you used Bloodspiller/Quietus.


Dark Arts is its own separate button again but sits on a 60 second cooldown which for 10 seconds boosts the potency of all weaponskills/spells by 140, which then upgrades into Delirium, increasing the duration to 20 seconds and removing Blood gauge costs during those 20 seconds, which upgrades into Living Shadow(can still have the pet thing) and changes the potency increase from 140 to 400 and increases duration to 25 seconds.


Living Dead gets the trait Sole Survivor, where if Living Dead fades naturally or "Walking Dead" condition that requires 100% HP to be fully restored fulfilled, it applies "Another Victim" status which prevents you HP from dropping below 1HP for 15 seconds and fully restores HP once it fades(recast timer will need to be bumped to 420 seconds for this to be balanced).


And Dark Passenger is brought back as level 40 ability.


EDIT: Reviving this thread because I believe that there is a better way to fix DRK as well as address a compromise to certain skills that I have disdain for(I hope I'm using the word "disdain" right).

For clarification see the following threads:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...oing-to-be-fun...


http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...llow-up-thread

[Deceptus]

And Dark Passenger is brought back as level 40 ability.

The absolute last thing DRK needs is MORE aoe damage abilities. They have 7 as it is now (too many IMHO)