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  1. #1
    Player
    Granyala's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,635
    Character
    Ifalna Sha'yoko
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixxe View Post
    You're literally arguing that it's a good thing because it gives you less of a reason to play this game. You are the last person anyone in SE should cater to. Stop trying to take the game away from people who enjoy it, to say nothing of insisting you're doing us a favor in doing so.
    Correct, although I do believe I didn't make my intentions clear enough:

    Games have addictive tendencies to it. These can be enforced through design or mitigated.
    A responsible game DEV finds a balance and puts in restrictions in order to avoid that the players damage themselves.
    If a design basically requires you to no-life it in order to get anywhere (Hello, ARR spiritbinding), that is a harmful design, should be considered as that and be avoided.

    This has nothing to do with "geeking out" over a game or taking things away from people. I like to geek out over Lore and class design as much as the next guy and certainly won't chastise people for being invested into these things.
    You don't have to design the game as a soul crushing RNG grind in order for people to have fun. What I am advocating here is not "less game" in a strict sense but more "different game".

    I am advocating: less dumb, mindless time requirement and more skill/brainpower requirement.
    I want to see more intelligent games and less tedious ones. I want to use my head in order to achieve success and not be beaten simply because I have life, other hobbies and a job and cannot dedicate an absurd amount of time into a video game.

    An example of that kind of system would be the old WoW vanilla PvP ranks that basically required 24h play to stay at the top, account sharing included.

    That should be in all our interest because using our brains is much more fun that doing the same mundane thing over and over and over and hope that some RNG decides that you will now be granted "success".

    In that regard: yes, I totally agree that the current crafting system is too mindless and easy. So was the old one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nixxe View Post
    Because Savage and Ultimate are in many respects their own reward, so removing the gear from them doesn't actually do much.
    Yeahh.. no. Sorry, nope.
    As a raider with about a decade of experience, I can tell you that individuals that stick through 100s of wipes for the sake of the challenge are few and far inbetween. Certainly not enough to form a healthy raiding community. Sadly (and this is where a lot of inner raid conflicts stem from) most people are in it for the shinies.

    Personally I always hated farming bosses for gear. I don't care about gear at all (barring looks for kitty dress-up of course ). If it were up to me, we would kill a boss once or twice and then move on to the next. Because the challenge has been beaten and that boss no longer holds my interest.
    (3)
    Last edited by Granyala; 07-25-2019 at 06:17 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Nixxe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    1,470
    Character
    Nixx Delumi
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Correct, although I do believe I didn't make my intentions clear enough:

    ...

    Because the challenge has been beaten and that boss no longer holds my interest.
    If you want to talk about addiction, look in a mirror. You aren't comfortable going without rewards from a part of the game you don't like playing and insist on subjecting yourself to. Contrast with those of us who enjoy it and do it because of that. I quit this game regularly when it gets in the way of other things I feel are more important and I routinely make the decision that certain rewards aren't worth it and shrug my shoulders and move on with my day. If you have a problem, that's your personal business and it should be kept that way. Don't demand to inflict it on the rest of us, especially not while pretending you're anyone a favor. Crafting has never been a soul crushing grind and if you feel differently, then grow the backbone to say, "Hey, this is not fun and I will not spend my time doing this." Don't try to "help" people who do enjoy it by taking away their fun.

    And yeah, sorry, nope. I also have extensive raid experience and at a fairy high level at that. Most of the gear-driven players are in lower ranked guilds and never get much past that. I also don't consider them worth thinking about because they're some of the worst people to have in your raid and if they all quit, the raid scene would be a better place after the initial collapse and restructuring of lower end guilds. At higher levels you have a much, much higher concentration of people who are there to push themselves and do difficult content. Gear is valued, certainly, but it's not the primary motivation. Then of course you have a ton of people at all levels who enjoy the social aspect of raiding.
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player
    Granyala's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,635
    Character
    Ifalna Sha'yoko
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixxe View Post
    If you want to talk about addiction, look in a mirror. You aren't comfortable going without rewards from a part of the game you don't like playing and insist on subjecting yourself to.
    This sentence makes no sense at all.
    I merely craft in order to be self sufficient. I don't like feeding other players gil in order to get raidfood etc. Once leveled I don't do much with the crafters unless I need sth. There is no addiction here on my side at all, in fact, Ifalna is already in maintenance mode.

    I go "Hey, this is not fun and I will not spend my time doing this." at plenty of aspects in the game, don't worry. I am old enough to decide what it worth my time and what is not.

    Only when people clamor for games to go back to the ways of time invested > everything else, I do voice a countering opinion because I consider it a stupid design choice.

    As for raiding: yup, the top tier doesn't have the problems with the gearheads (I always envied that) but alas not everyone has the skills in order to compete at that level and I have no shame in admitting that I am one of them. It's not about practice etc either. I just cannot react fast enough, and I know my limits. Shit happens.
    (3)