Being denied the ability to ask questions in Feast is miserable

[Nalien]

I'd rather have people playing mid-match than being keyboard warriors.

That said, I see no reason why we cannot have access to chat during the minutes wait at the start of matches... Whole point of that wait is to prepare, I imagine, strategy... Can't really do that when you cannot say a word to your team, though...

It's kind of funny...and sad when people will act like the rear end of an incontinent horse then wonder why stuff like chat is revoked. Like, how dare consequences occour for my actions? If ya don't want privileges revoked try not acting like a raging 12 year old.

Glaring generalizations aren't particularly helpful, or do you really think that every player in Feast would act like a raging child had they access to chat? There are plenty of helpful people in my experience, who fully deserve the opportunity to communicate with, and help, other players. Such people would be well within their right to question why they cannot do that...

If anything "No access to chat in Feast" should be a punishment, not the norm. Revoke that right from people who do act like petulant infants, leave chat open to people who have some common decency.

Heck, I've seen plenty of childish tantrums in PvE in this game... By the same logic chat should be locked in PvE, but can you imagine the outcry if literally every player was thus denied chat access, simply because of the tantrums of a few idiots? It's absurd, really. No, people who act out in such ways are punished accordingly in PvE. No reason a similar solution shouldn't apply to PvP. All it really does is damage Feast and contributes to a negative impression to the majority of the playerbase ("Feast is so toxic chat was disabled completely"). Far better solutions at hand, but none affordable by a small indie company, I imagine.

[DJMau]

I didn't say every, but enough in that community did so to the point chat was revoked. Actions and consequences. A bit extreme yes but it solved the issue of toxic man babies spewing their verbal waste.

Also given the variance of bad apples to good in both scenarios PvP has a greater concentration than the rest of the game, so naturally it would be a bit more obvious there. People can throw all the salt at SE they want, but they aren't the problem.

[Nova_Rox]

I didn't say every, but enough in that community did so to the point chat was revoked. Actions and consequences. A bit extreme yes but it solved the issue of toxic man babies spewing their verbal waste.

Also given the variance of bad apples to good in both scenarios PvP has a greater concentration than the rest of the game, so naturally it would be a bit more obvious there. People can throw all the salt at SE they want, but they aren't the problem.

Comparing PvP to ALL of PvE is asinine.

Compare PvP chat to PF runs of ex and savage? That's a more fair comparison, and trust me when I say I've seen some "man babies" as you say.

Also, have you ever done a 24 man raid? This is CASUAL content and we have people throwing insults well beyond your normal curse words.

End of the day the fact is that there are bad apples in PvE and PvP. We've come to a point where we need chat back in order to help foster growth of the community. As it is right now new players come on, have no idea why they just got stomped and stop playing because of it.

[Saintly]

Blacklist exist for a reason, i don't see why everyone should be penalized cause crybabies don't want to use it.

[Gallus]

And for what? To cater to pantywaists who become emotionally distressed when people say mean things about their play in a video game?

Because the root of the problem is that people are too sensitive of course, people should enjoy getting insulted, wished cancer and asked to kill themselves over a lost match. People can't behave on the internet it's 2019 you should know this by now, PVP communities are sewers and people have repeteadly demonstrated the inability to not react like demented monkeys with anger issues when things go wrong. If you want PVP advice ask around in the forums, your FC or even in the same wolves den. There's also a PVP discord channel if I'm not mistaken, though I've heard a few horror stories about it. Your call.

[Nova_Rox]

Because the root of the problem is that people are too sensitive of course, people should enjoy getting insulted, wished cancer and asked to kill themselves over a lost match. People can't behave on the internet it's 2019 you should know this by now, PVP communities are sewers and people have repeteadly demonstrated the inability to not react like demented monkeys with anger issues when things go wrong. If you want PVP advice ask around in the forums, your FC or even in the same wolves den. There's also a PVP discord channel if I'm not mistaken, though I've heard a few horror stories about it. Your call.

The fact that you claim it's only in PvP shows how biased you are. I implore you go do some PF runs of CURRENT Ex/Savage content. Or actually, even some nice casual 24 mans. If you say the toxicity doesn't exist there, then...sorry, you're just lying.

By your logic we shouldn't be allowed to chat anywhere in the game. Your examples are extreme examples which, quite frankly, are nothing more than a straw man. Please kindly reconsider how your respond to the topic at hand until you're ready to leave emotionally charged buzz words out of it. It's fairly safe to assume that most players don't want folks getting cancer wished upon them and whatnot.

I'm also curious about said horror stories from MODERN days about the discord channels. I'm an admin for Revival Wings and a mentor in PvPaissa and I seem to have missed them. Kindly bring them to my attention, or others that are involved in leadership.

Blacklist exist for a reason, i don't see why everyone should be penalized cause crybabies don't want to use it.

I agree. Blacklist and reports should be how chat is handled in PvP. Handout nice long bans/temp bans for the extreme cases our friend Gallus pointed out up top.

At the VERY least let us chat pre/post game. The amount of new players with no idea where to go for guidance is astonishing. The amount of new players that get chased away because they think "Hello!" is BM is probably just as scary.

[Gallus]

The fact that you claim it's only in PvP shows how biased you are. I implore you go do some PF runs of CURRENT Ex/Savage content. Or actually, even some nice casual 24 mans. If you say the toxicity doesn't exist there, then...sorry, you're just lying.

By your logic we shouldn't be allowed to chat anywhere in the game. Your examples are extreme examples which, quite frankly, are nothing more than a straw man. Please kindly reconsider how your respond to the topic at hand until you're ready to leave emotionally charged buzz words out of it. It's fairly safe to assume that most players don't want folks getting cancer wished upon them and whatnot.

Biased?

It's called experience. I've been playing this game since ARR, witnessed and ran through almost every savage, many times without a static, outright pugging savage fights, ex primals, running through thousands of dungeons, I've completed I'd say 90% of the extreme primals of all expansions, and most of them I did it with people who I did not know. Yes, you come across the occasional douche that will complain even about the silliest thing, and the tank/healer disputes pop up occasionally too.

However, compare this with the amount of malodorous, insane and obnoxious garbage I've witnessed when I played PVP and you instantly realize that PVE is like a paradise of good behaviour.
Insulting personal messages, chat flooding with hello! followed by an ignore mark spammed on your head every second for the next 3 minutes (you'd think removing chat would stop toxicity right? think again).
And it's not just this game.

Tekken? Personal message through PSN telling you that you are a spammer and that you should kill yourself (along with disconnects at the very last second so that your opponent knows you won't get your points).

League of Legends? Getting wished cancer is probably the softest sort of flame you'll receive if anyone thinks they've lost a ranked match because of you.

Overwatch? Again, nasty stuff regarding what hero you should pick or stop picking because someone considers the team is losing because of you. From threatening messages to any sort of hate mail.

Could go on forever.

And then you'd think...perhaps I'm the problem right? Perhaps the harassment is justified and I'm actually dragging my team down so people are often mad at me? But how does that make any sense when you have a 70% winning rate League of Legends Diamond rank account? Wanna know the answer? Even with a 70% winning rate you still lose, and when that happens flame occurs. It's automatic.

And then you have PVE, things like Resident Evil 5 and mercenaries, which I played for hundreds of hours and had not received a single insult (not a freaking single insult throughout months) even when things went wrong and me and my ally were bitten to death because of my fault. Could give you a lot of more examples like RE5 but the wall of text is big enough already.

Biased?

More like 15 years of gaming online experience on my shoulders seeing what kind of stuff you come across in PVE and what kind of stuff you come across in PVP.

Oh and I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to chat. I'm not the one deciding to remove the chat because PVP communities behave like monkeys with anger issues. Companies do that. Have you ever asked yourself why the FFXIV PVE chat is not disabled while the PVP one is?

Like yeah, keep lying to yourself, for what I care.

[Nova_Rox]

Biased?

It's called experience. I've been playing this game since ARR, witnessed and ran through almost every savage, many times without a static, outright pugging savage fights, ex primals, running through thousands of dungeons, I've completed I'd say 90% of the extreme primals of all expansions, and most of them I did it with people who I did not know. Yes, you come across the occasional douche that will complain even about the silliest thing, and the tank/healer disputes pop up occasionally too.

However, compare this with the amount of malodorous, insane and obnoxious garbage I've witnessed when I played PVP and you instantly realize that PVE is like a paradise of good behaviour.
Insulting personal messages, chat flooding with hello! followed by an ignore mark spammed on your head every second for the next 3 minutes (you'd think removing chat would stop toxicity right? think again).
And it's not just this game.

Tekken? Personal message through PSN telling you that you are a spammer and that you should kill yourself (along with disconnects at the very last second so that your opponent knows you won't get your points).

League of Legends? Getting wished cancer is probably the softest sort of flame you'll receive if anyone thinks they've lost a ranked match because of you.

Overwatch? Again, nasty stuff regarding what hero you should pick or stop picking because someone considers the team is losing because of you. From threatening messages to any sort of hate mail.

Could go on forever.

And then you'd think...perhaps I'm the problem right? Perhaps the harassment is justified and I'm actually dragging my team down so people are often mad at me? But how does that make any sense when you have a 70% winning rate League of Legends Diamond rank account? Wanna know the answer? Even with a 70% winning rate you still lose, and when that happens flame occurs. It's automatic.

And then you have PVE, things like Resident Evil 5 and mercenaries, which I played for hundreds of hours and had not received a single insult (not a freaking single insult throughout months) even when things went wrong and me and my ally were bitten to death because of my fault. Could give you a lot of more examples like RE5 but the wall of text is big enough already.

Biased?

More like 15 years of gaming online experience on my shoulders seeing what kind of stuff you come across in PVE and what kind of stuff you come across in PVP.

Oh and I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to chat. I'm not the one deciding to remove the chat because PVP communities behave like monkeys with anger issues. Companies do that. Have you ever asked yourself why the FFXIV PVE chat is not disabled while the PVP one is?

Like yeah, keep lying to yourself, for what I care.

You list off a bunch of things that have literally nothing to do with anything at hand.

You list off your "accomplishments" as if it means something. Guess what? It doesn't. The fact that you've been gaming for 15 years means nothing, especially when you consider the fact that you know nothing about me and for all you know I've been gaming even longer. So just stop. It doesn't add anything to what you're saying.

You're so closed minded that it's mind boggling.

Here, let me spell it out for you. The same people you claim to be toxic in PvP also play PvE. I want you to answer honestly, how many times do people say "I'm only here for tomes xd" when you're playing? How many of THOSE are the ones that are complaining in chat? It's insane to me how you cannot realize that the same people you complain about in PvP are playing PvE with you...and probably play PvE as their main source of entertainment.

The answer? Most of them.

How do I know? Because I'm part of that PvP community you're so adamant is rotten to the core and I'm sick and tired of people like you coming online to bash the ENTIRE PvP community with generalizations. It's disgusting and needs to stop.

https://pvpaissa.com/

Check it out. Go see how many community ran events we've hosted. Join us in our Discord servers and see for yourself how friendly folks are. No, I'm serious. Come on in with an open mind and see for yourself the truly dedicated folks like myself, the other PvPaissa staff members and the Revival Wings admins. Come and see how hard we work to keep a fun community for everyone.

To go through so much work and put in so much effort just to have some random person talk without any knowledge is just outrageous.

So yeah, keep lying to yourself, for what I care.

[Gallus]

Of course I know nothing about you, am I even judging you in the first place? If you play PVP and you are content with it and have built a nice group of FFXIV PVPers good for you. I've been gaming enough time to draw my own conclusions and speak from experience about what I think PVP communities have turned into.

And I have a lot of reasons to think this terrible normalized behaviour that has been established in the pvp communities (and that is very well known at this point) draws away a lot of potential good mannered players that say nope to all this.

I'm not lying if I told you I've ran thousands of dungeons in this game, this is no exaggeration, thousands of them, the times someone has legitimately made me feel bad in one them? I could probably count these situations with the fingers of my two hands since ARR (you know, the very occasional premade kicking you out of a dungeon or someone extremely rude), and again, this is NO exaggeration, maybe 5 or 6 situations where I was really offended and reported a DF group for kicking me out of the blue or being extremely rude.

The amount of times someone has made me feel bad in a PVP environment? Jesuschrist... countless of them. Countless. I could spend 2 entire days counting and it wouldn't be over.

Wanna guess why I kept playing despite the above? Because I like gaming, and I like competition, but at some point it was completely unbearable, so yeah, I stopped.

Hate me as much as you want, but I think I'm not the one you should be hating here.

[Ixon]

Oh and I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to chat. I'm not the one deciding to remove the chat because PVP communities behave like monkeys with anger issues. Companies do that. Have you ever asked yourself why the FFXIV PVE chat is not disabled while the PVP one is?

Like yeah, keep lying to yourself, for what I care.

Let's make something clear, FFXIV PVP isn't toxic; some PEOPLE who play in FFXIV PVP are. You cannot slap a broad generalization based off your biased opinion and state is as fact. There are bad/toxic people who do every sort of content: Savage raids, Hunts; did you ever do BA? That was the most toxic stuff I have EVER seen. And no shit competitive ANYTHING can be toxic, it's in it's nature sometimes. Emotions get very high, some swing in a good way, other times is doesn't, you cannot possibly avoid every bad egg in the world.

And to answer your question, you know why PVP chat was disabled? Cause it was easy. That's literally it. In a high emotional state that is ANY PVP in ANY game, measures are taken to reduce toxicity, Overwatch is a great example, but that is a game built on PVP. Where in FFXIV it's in addition to, it costs time and resources to manage that kind of stuff like Overwatch does, and because PVE is more of the focus, it was easier to just cut it without actually fixing it. Disabling chat literally did nothing to stop toxic people from being toxic. They just find more inventive ways.