Thread: 5.0 AST is a failure

Originally Posted by LegoTechnic

People do like their fads, but rest assured the second players start looking to make parse runs the AST will be back in, even with the nerfed cards. WHM is in a really strong spot for progression and while ilvl is low where its heals get the most weight for their costs, but AST will be the go-to when players feel more comfortable with the encounters. PUGs are one thing, since you can't really trust randoms so you try to hedge your bets for safety, but if it becomes an issue for you try making a party of your own. Don't leave all the responsibility in the hands of meta-slaves.

https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1046&class=Any Innocence EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Innocence EX Healing
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1045&class=Any Titania EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Titania EX Healing

When it comes to DPS its no contest, ASTs cards wont bring enough difference due to how weak and short duration they are for the amount of effort you need to put into them for Divination windows. When it comes to healing its no contest period. People are excluding AST because it is a deficit to run an AST over a WHM or SCH. This is not a matter of being comfortable with the fights, this is a matter of the potencies and buffs being too weak to overlook.

Originally Posted by TankHunter678

https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1046&class=Any Innocence EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Innocence EX Healing
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1045&class=Any Titania EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Titania EX Healing

When it comes to DPS its no contest, ASTs cards wont bring enough difference due to how weak and short duration they are for the amount of effort you need to put into them for Divination windows. When it comes to healing its no contest period. People are excluding AST because it is a deficit to run an AST over a WHM or SCH. This is not a matter of being comfortable with the fights, this is a matter of the potencies and buffs being too weak to overlook.

Damn,

Innocence (healing): AST only 17% of parses
Titania(healing): AST only 17.55% of parses

That alone should tell you how bad of shape the job is in. Roughly half of ideal. But at least it's consistently sh!t.

Originally Posted by TankHunter678

https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1046&class=Any Innocence EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Innocence EX Healing
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...1045&class=Any Titania EX DPS
https://www.fflogs.com/zone/statisti...Any&metric=hps Titania EX Healing

When it comes to DPS its no contest, ASTs cards wont bring enough difference due to how weak and short duration they are for the amount of effort you need to put into them for Divination windows. When it comes to healing its no contest period. People are excluding AST because it is a deficit to run an AST over a WHM or SCH. This is not a matter of being comfortable with the fights, this is a matter of the potencies and buffs being too weak to overlook.

I agree that AST is in a really bad spot atm but I think he/she was trying to say that AST will be brought to raids to pad the parses of the other player's dps just so that people can get that oranges, not that AST will speed up the kill.

Originally Posted by Crushnight

The thing with this is you then have to ask the question do the buffs provide more dps than the time taking off from killing the fight faster with another hlr, if they do ast will be used for pad runs if they don't ast becomes useless compared to the other two healers.

Lots of people only care about themselves, and couldn't care less about the overall picture. I used to play with this BLM who would sit in AOE's if it wouldn't result in them being 1 hit. He was an orange parser in Savage Tier Raids last expansion.

Originally Posted by Crushnight

the question still remains though is the dps buffs from the cards > the dps gained from killing faster? the answer should always be a yes but SE has made weird design choices in the past ho knows what the future holds

No, but people will still want Ast because they only care about their own DPS.

Originally Posted by Ftail

No, but people will still want Ast because they only care about their own DPS.

Well, good news, FTail: that's what DNC is for. AST would not be ideal for that position because of the potential downtime between applied buffs, as well as the insignificance of their output.

Lately, I've been thinking that it's time for Squeen to accept that they've created jobs which don't fit into their roles as precisely as they want, for the sake of their contrived balance, and just create a Support job role for those classes. The support job role would be able to provide the party with a variety of advantages while posing potentially as off-DPS and/or off-healing, but wouldn't necessarily be the strongest. I'd imagine that jobs such as BRD (though, not in the current not-so-bard-like state that it's in now), DNC, and AST would fit into the role, and each jobs skills/spells/abilities and potencies would need to be revisited in order to make that work. To that end, I'd think that 4-man parties would be formed with 1 each of Tank, Healer, Support, and DPS, while the 8 mans would ideally be comprised of 2 tanks, 1 healer, 1 support, 4 DPS.

Otherwise, regarding this topic directly: it sort of feels like they wanted to use AST as an experiment. They've previously decided that they wanted the healers to spend more time focused on healing, and, for the most part, they've achieved that on AST, but now they get to gauge if this is an effective strategy for the other healers, or if their experiment was a failure. Regarding cards, they probably thought about it from a DPS perspective (more damage up = better, right?), and figured that was enough.