Dark Knight follow up thread

[Gemina]

I didn't play HW DRK, so any comparisons to it I will be completely ignorant to. I also don't play PLD or WAR; comments pertaining to DRK being just an edgy WAR will also fall on deaf ears. I can only compare SB and ShB DRK, and I am still working on getting to 80 (currently 73). But anyone who took DRK to max in SB will immediately feel the changes to DRK in ShB. I'll have to chime in again after getting it to max, but right now my observations pertain mostly to the battle system changes.

I am really enjoying most of the changes to DRK, but that does not mean I don't have any issues with it. I can say that I am fully glad that DA is gone. I honestly have no idea how anyone could enjoy this ability as it was in SB. What has seemed to kind of replace it is Bloodspiller/Quietus spam when using Delirium, so my issue isn't really with Quietus or BS, but rather Delirium. I feel this ability should be much more impactful than allowing for free cost of blood abilities. Blood abilities should ALWAYS cost you blood, that is why they are blood abilities. I would much rather Delirium improve the effectiveness of these abilities, or the DRK in some other way. Delirium feels like it is in limbo, and the devs aren't quite sure what to do with it.

I miss the HP siphoning with DA+Abysmal Drain on large packs of mobs. This was very satisfying. I believe this is gone in order to increase healing requirements, so I am ok with it. However, I think that 60s CD can be reduced, or be reduced as a bonus to something like a successful Stalwart Soul combo. In short, I don't think it is a good idea for the devs to take something from DRK that utilizes MP as a resource and change it to an ability with a long CD.

I don't understand the giant nerf to Salted Earth. Someone help me here. I hope it doesn't have anything to do with adding DA potency to everything that previously could be boosted by it. I'm also not a big fan of Blood Weapon. Before it felt like, "Here comes the pain!" Now it just feels like I'm desperate for MP.

All in all, I don't feel like it is slower, or clunkier than it used to be. It is more simple to play now, but that doesn't make it less engaging. Godsend changes for me are taking Grit off of the GCD, the loss of DA, the addition of Arm's Length to role skills, and the new charge system applying to Plunge. These were all things I was asking for DRK prior to ShB in order to improve it (shorter CD in the case of Plunge). The other was either removing MP cost from Dark Passenger, or the CD duration. Flood is basically the latter.

[Keagian]

One thing I loved about SB DRK was how their resources would pool back into one another. You would pull with Abyssal Drain for ranged targets then you would pop Blood Price, which allowed you to gain some MP and Blood. Then you would use your MP to get back HP, when MP was low you would use Blood to gain back MP, if you had no blood then you would hope that TBN popped so you would get back some blood, and you would cycle through this over and over with TBN, DA+Abyssal Drain, and DA+Quietus, it was fun and allowed things to flow smoothly. You were constantly refilling and spending your resources and using your CD when needed in dungeon runs.

ShB you spam your two AoE combo, throw out TBN and hope it breaks and sometimes use Quietus if you have blood, throw out some a Rampart or Arm's Length to help mitigate some damage. Its very boring and things don't flow too well together and with the increase in gear your TBN might not even break so you don't get to use Flood of Shadow to increase your damage and extend your Darkside timer.

For Trial fights, everything is pretty straight forward and played like a slower SB DRK since you have to wait for MP to recover so you could throw out a Edge of Shadow every now and again or make sure your CD were on CD.

[DRKoftheAzure]

I think I figured out why I like GNB, and the first two iterations of DRK; there is a lot of buttons to press to max out DPS(though for Heavensward DRK Dark Arts was need to max out both DPS and and tanking whereas Stormblood DRK was just DPS to max out).


Shadowbringers DRK doesn't have a lot of offensive based cooldowns which explains why it feels EXTREMELY SLOW. It's also probably why I don't like playing PLD or WAR...


And I play on controller using WXHB with most of my buttons set at when you get them by level(Basically muscle memory) and I also started using macros just for some of GNB skills, and I put stances on expanded XHB along with the macros(macros are for when I am offtanking or Gnashing Fang combo).

[Nedkel]

I think I figured out why I like GNB, and the first two iterations of DRK; there is a lot of buttons to press to max out DPS(though for Heavensward DRK Dark Arts was need to max out both DPS and and tanking whereas Stormblood DRK was just DPS to max out).


Shadowbringers DRK doesn't have a lot of offensive based cooldowns which explains why it feels EXTREMELY SLOW. It's also probably why I don't like playing PLD or WAR...


And I play on controller using WXHB with most of my buttons set at when you get them by level(Basically muscle memory) and I also started using macros just for some of GNB skills, and I put stances on expanded XHB along with the macros(macros are for when I am offtanking or Gnashing Fang combo).

But GNB is about as fast as DRK. >.>

[MerlinCross]

But GNB is about as fast as DRK. >.>

I believe part of that problem is we have less buttons to press but we have to use them more often. Sure it might be(doesn't feel it to me) as fast or APM as GNB, but it's also having to hit Bloodspiller 4-5 times every so often and Edge as well. GNB looks to have more to juggle/cycle through by comparison at least at a glance.

[DRKoftheAzure]

I believe part of that problem is we have less buttons to press but we have to use them more often. Sure it might be(doesn't feel it to me) as fast or APM as GNB, but it's also having to hit Bloodspiller 4-5 times every so often and Edge as well. GNB looks to have more to juggle/cycle through by comparison at least at a glance.

And yeah I do like juggling between my GCD combos... over spamming the same 1 GCD 5 times...

[Sancho_Nyanta]

I think I figured out why I like GNB, and the first two iterations of DRK; there is a lot of buttons to press to max out DPS(though for Heavensward DRK Dark Arts was need to max out both DPS and and tanking whereas Stormblood DRK was just DPS to max out).


Shadowbringers DRK doesn't have a lot of offensive based cooldowns which explains why it feels EXTREMELY SLOW. It's also probably why I don't like playing PLD or WAR...


And I play on controller using WXHB with most of my buttons set at when you get them by level(Basically muscle memory) and I also started using macros just for some of GNB skills, and I put stances on expanded XHB along with the macros(macros are for when I am offtanking or Gnashing Fang combo).

Yeah, if you are talking about all CD that add offensive advantages and not necessarily just damage then the 2 are almost equal.

GNB has 6 oGCD offensive skills:
No Mercy, Blasting Zone, Bow Shock, Bloodfest, Rough Divide, and Continuation

DRK has 7 oGCD offensive skills:
Abyssal Drain, Carve & Spit, Salted Earth, Bloodweapon, Plunge, Delirium, and the Edge/Flood of Shadows (counting these as 1 since you won't use them separately)

You can even match up the CDs to see the buttons/min are almost the same too. The differences are that you will hit Continuation 6 times a min on GNB but you'll hit Edge/Flood 4 times a min and Delirium every 1.5 min on DRK.

[DRKoftheAzure]

Yeah, if you are talking about all CD that add offensive advantages and not necessarily just damage then the 2 are almost equal.

GNB has 6 oGCD offensive skills:
No Mercy, Blasting Zone, Bow Shock, Bloodfest, Rough Divide, and Continuation

DRK has 7 oGCD offensive skills:
Abyssal Drain, Carve & Spit, Salted Earth, Bloodweapon, Plunge, Delirium, and the Edge/Flood of Shadows (counting these as 1 since you won't use them separately)

You can even match up the CDs to see the buttons/min are almost the same too. The differences are that you will hit Continuation 6 times a min on GNB but you'll hit Edge/Flood 4 times a min and Delirium every 1.5 min on DRK.

Blood Weapon, Salted Earth, Delirium, and Edge/Flood of Darkness/Shadow do not count...


I'm also not counting No Mercy and Bloodfest...

[Sancho_Nyanta]

Blood Weapon, Salted Earth, Delirium, and Edge/Flood of Darkness/Shadow do not count...


I'm also not counting No Mercy and Bloodfest...

Ok I'll bite, why do you not include Edge/Flood and Salted Earth on Drk but do include Bow Shock and Continuation on Gnb? Both SE and BS are oGCD Dots and both Continuation and the Shadow/Darkness skills are oGCD attacks that you will hit over the course of the fight.

Also I don't know why you'd exclude Delirium, Blood Weapon, No Mercy, and Bloodfest. If you'd said Damage based cooldown then at least I would understand why you'd exclude them as they don't directly apply damage. However based on the fact that you said "Offensive based cooldowns", I don't see how anyone could say that these skills are anything other than an Offensive based cooldowns.

[DRKoftheAzure]

Ok I'll bite, why do you not include Edge/Flood and Salted Earth on Drk but do include Bow Shock and Continuation on Gnb? Both SE and BS are oGCD Dots and both Continuation and the Shadow/Darkness skills are oGCD attacks that you will hit over the course of the fight.

Also I don't know why you'd exclude Delirium, Blood Weapon, No Mercy, and Bloodfest. If you'd said Damage based cooldown then at least I would understand why you'd exclude them as they don't directly apply damage. However based on the fact that you said "Offensive based cooldowns", I don't see how anyone could say that these skills are anything other than an Offensive based cooldowns.

Yeah, I couldn't tell you why I'm not counting Edge/Flood of Darkness/Shadow, as for Salted Earth it's classified as a buff rather than an actual DoT, plus it doesn't any initial damage when you use it... as for excluding Delirium(A.K.A. discount Inner Release) it's buff that lets you spam one button 5 times which is more just as boring as spamming your 1 single target combo for 90 seconds, Blood Weapon just sucks to use now, No Mercy is a decent buff but does not count as an actual attack, and Bloodfest just gives you 2 more cartridges and also does not count as an actual attack...


Also people Are going to confuse Bow Shock with Bloodspiller now, and same with Salted Earth and Souleater(or Square-Enix)... Suck to be the new people who are trying to learn the terminology...