Dark Knight follow up thread

[Yeol]

Idk why people are complaining about tank damage when the difference between top tank dps and lowest tank dps is less than 300.

Example (E2N):
GNB: 7,459.58 (Top)
PLD: 7,442.58
WAR: 7,229.49
DRK: 7,193.09 (Bottom)

GNB - DRK = 7,459.58 - 7,193.09 = 266.49

Numbers might look deceiving at first glance, but in reality, the difference is not that big.
I won't be concerned with tank personal dps unless the difference is much bigger.

With that small difference, I'd say just play the tank you enjoy most.

[TheRealQuah]

Idk why people are complaining about tank damage when the difference between top tank dps and lowest tank dps is less than 300.

Example (E2N):
GNB: 7,459.58 (Top)
PLD: 7,442.58
WAR: 7,229.49
DRK: 7,193.09 (Bottom)

GNB - DRK = 7,459.58 - 7,193.09 = 266.49

Numbers might look deceiving at first glance, but in reality, the difference is not that big.
I won't be concerned with tank personal dps unless the difference is much bigger.

With that small difference, I'd say just play the tank you enjoy most.

Definitely agree with all this.

Personally though think it should go GNB > DRK > PLD > WAR. Crit scaling will mean by the end of the expansion WAR will be top.

[Lyth]

I don't see how that's any different from doing two Rage of Halone combos, popping Fight or Flight into Circle of Scorn/Spirits Within, unlocking your Enchanted Dark Arts Riposte combo and then finishing up with Bloodspiller. Over and over again.

I get that you don't like the new DRK, but let's stop with the sour grapes. It's always the same three people complaining. Especially when you're playing GNB of all things.

[DRKoftheAzure]

So far I have not been convinced as to why you would bring a DRK over PLD, WAR, or GNB in terms of either main tank or off tank, because DRK cannot carry the group from wiping to a boss because healer died, even though GNB also has this problem as well, you are better off taking any of the other tanks over DRK in dungeons.


The Blackest Night is a good shield yes, but as a DPS tool you are better not having a gimmick on it if it's just DPS neutral or loss.


And I see no reason to run double DRK because how bad Living Dead is because you waste resources just to get DRK up to full HP and you NEED TO GET DRK TO FULL HP OR THEY DIE WITH WALKING DEAD.


Dark Mind is worse than Rampart just because it only reduces magic damage taken since the number of tankbusters is half physical and half magical.


Darkside has the same problems that it had in Heavensward which I understand why people liked it but now it's way worse because you can't prep Darkside outside of combat and you might as well be taking MNK over DRK.


DRK is for those players who just hate people in general and do not want to take responsibility for any slip ups they did and just make other peoples lives just as miserable as they are.


And I hate to say it but if they do want to make DRK fun they need to retcon the DRK story quests.


But alternatively they could just not retcon the lore and make it fun, lore be damned.

[jetfire117]

So far I have not been convinced as to why you would bring a DRK over PLD, WAR, or GNB in terms of either main tank or off tank, because DRK cannot carry the group from wiping to a boss because healer died, even though GNB also has this problem as well, you are better off taking any of the other tanks over DRK in dungeons.


The Blackest Night is a good shield yes, but as a DPS tool you are better not having a gimmick on it if it's just DPS neutral or loss.


And I see no reason to run double DRK because how bad Living Dead is because you waste resources just to get DRK up to full HP and you NEED TO GET DRK TO FULL HP OR THEY DIE WITH WALKING DEAD.


Dark Mind is worse than Rampart just because it only reduces magic damage taken since the number of tankbusters is half physical and half magical.


Darkside has the same problems that it had in Heavensward which I understand why people liked it but now it's way worse because you can't prep Darkside outside of combat and you might as well be taking MNK over DRK.


DRK is for those players who just hate people in general and do not want to take responsibility for any slip ups they did and just make other peoples lives just as miserable as they are.


And I hate to say it but if they do want to make DRK fun they need to retcon the DRK story quests.


But alternatively they could just not retcon the lore and make it fun, lore be damned.

I didn't know it was April 2020 already.

[Hierro]

So far I have not been convinced as to why you would bring a DRK over PLD, WAR, or GNB in terms of either main tank or off tank, because DRK cannot carry the group from wiping to a boss because healer died, even though GNB also has this problem as well, you are better off taking any of the other tanks over DRK in dungeons.

In a fight like Titania EX, DRK has the flexibility to do either MT or OT role. LD has a long enough duration to be used with ease, convenience, and leniency on Fae Light or tethers, and the cooldown is short enough to be used for both their second occurrences. GNB and WAR must be careful with their timings on tethers, and GNB/PLD must ask the other tank to share the second light. Also, TBN's short cooldown makes it extremely usable during adds. Hard Swipe will always see a TBN. In Innocence during add phase, every holy sword will see a TBN.

Whether or not you want to look at what DRK has as being noteworthy is not my problem, DRK's fine.

[BarretOblivion]

In a fight like Titania EX, DRK has the flexibility to do either MT or OT role. LD has a long enough duration to be used with ease, convenience, and leniency on Fae Light or tethers, and the cooldown is short enough to be used for both their second occurrences. GNB and WAR must be careful with their timings on tethers, and GNB/PLD must ask the other tank to share the second light. Also, TBN's short cooldown makes it extremely usable during adds. Hard Swipe will always see a TBN. In Innocence during add phase, every holy sword will see a TBN.

Whether or not you want to look at what DRK has as being noteworthy is not my problem, DRK's fine.

All tanks can invuln fae except the 2nd on Paladin while GNB gets Superboilde back a few seconds before the 2nd cast, even WAR if timed properly. The only tank that can't do the 3 tether strat is WAR. Doesn't make LD a good tank invuln. Again, the requirement for healers to 100% your HP is the part that breaks it from being a decent cooldown to a straight garbage one. Lets look at all the other tanks invulns

WAR: Shortest cooldown allowing the most uses in the fight. WAR can self heal and use thrill of battle to help heal almost half thier HP by themselves.
GNB: Its an invuln that brings them down to 1. Will get about the same amount of uses as LD. Healers can drop a regen on them to heal after use and a GNB can drop their own regen to heal themselves up.
PLD: Full damage immunity with no drawback besides long cooldown. Will be able to use 2 times during a fight. Lasts 10 secs allowing healers to just DPS.

Then there is DRK:
Must be healed a total of their health total in 10 secs once they drop to 1. They still TAKE DAMAGE while they are "walking dead" so any healing that is done is also ignored because they just lose that HP while healers are trying to hit the heal requirement. If you don't have a WHM its just a giant resource pit for healers and you have no way to help heal yourself.

No, Living Dead is terrible and should be avoided usage as much as possible. Tank swap before even consider Living Dead, you are hurting your group by using it without a WHM and if you do have a WHM now you are requiring them to have beni when you do use LD.

[Danelo]

In a fight like Titania EX, DRK has the flexibility to do either MT or OT role. LD has a long enough duration to be used with ease, convenience, and leniency on Fae Light or tethers, and the cooldown is short enough to be used for both their second occurrences. GNB and WAR must be careful with their timings on tethers, and GNB/PLD must ask the other tank to share the second light. Also, TBN's short cooldown makes it extremely usable during adds. Hard Swipe will always see a TBN. In Innocence during add phase, every holy sword will see a TBN.

Whether or not you want to look at what DRK has as being noteworthy is not my problem, DRK's fine.

When you start to advocate for LD people stop listening. It makes you sound horribly biased. It's a shit ability and every objective player knows it. When pre planned, short of a whm in the team, I die every use of it on Titania ex tethers and fae light.

[Hierro]

When you start to advocate for LD people stop listening. It makes you sound horribly biased. It's a shit ability and every objective player knows it. When pre planned, short of a whm in the team, I die every use of it on Titania ex tethers and fae light.

What I did was describe LD's qualities in an objective manner. It has a longer duration and has one of the shorter cooldowns as far as invulnerabilities are concerned. There just so happens to be an encounter where both of those qualities are taken advantage of. LD is what it is, and that's what good players understand.

Considering I've been using LD just fine and with everyday run of the mill pugs on crystal datacenter PF, I don't think the skill is the reason you keep dying. Besides, as things stand WHM is part of the meta, so LD requiring a bene appears to be a non-issue at the moment, and even if that wasn't the case, healers were getting along just fine all throughout HW when the meta was SCH+AST. Neither had bene yet still dealt with LD just fine.

[Danelo]

I'm not quite sure what you are insinuating by saying the skill isn't the reason I died... I popped it in between first fae light and second then went to 1 hp before the third hit... Check it worked. Oh but the healers couldn't save without beni. Same with the tethers. So what about that did I not do right?
Did I not use enough skills to heal myself up? AD with its 200 pot and SE at 300 pot when you finally get to it. Not going to do it. Death.
Did I not use any of my other healing abilities to help the heal myself? Nope, because I don't have anything else. Dead again.
Did I not take full advantage of a life steal(or some other) mechanic activated by walking dead to assist in healing myself. Nope, it doesn't exist. Still dead.
So if there's nothing in the DRK kit that allows me to help and I'm left with praying then I guess you're wrong and the ability killed me.

I'm glad you've come across good pugs on crystal datacenter but you're just spreading false info when you say this is a good invul.

As far as the longer duration - it depends. You have 9 seconds to go to 1 hp. After that you truly have 9 seconds to receive healing equal to your max hp. When is that point reached? No one knows until WD goes away. That's problem number 1. So let's say you and your whm time this perfectly - at max 18 to 19 seconds. Really that's just 9 seconds of time you can't die, not time that you don't take damage, bc almost every gain your non whm healers make is being wiped away by autos so even if you do live from WD you may die anyway depending on where the next follow up attack is. But hey, you managed to shave 8-10 seconds of its next recast. Great! Worst case scenario is that you don't cut much time off the next cd usage because it wasn't feasible or some other reason. Then you go down to 1 and you get beni right away and you got 1-2 seconds of "can't die" before you get killed by the next leg of a multi hit TB. It is a healer CD pit and not a true tank CD. Useless outside of group content. Completely depending on healers to make this ability ... Work.

There is no comparison to the other tank CDs as a stand alone or when you look at how the kit backs up that ability. You're being anything but objective if saying LD doesnt need a rework.


Side note: saying that whm is in the meta now, therefore a rework of living dead is not necessary, is a weak sauce excuse for devs to be lazy.