Thread: 5.0 WAR is a disappointment

the job is popular on hard content due TBN and only TBN, on TEA rules for dark mind too and thats it, for all the sprouds it's for marketing.

If feel that making NF castable on self, as well as on a party member, would solve everything and make it a proper ability. Because the way it is now, it's utter trash for a level 70+ ability.

If you're main tanking, it would be used as a sustain tool to help the healer. From my tests, you get about 60k healing if you manage to land 2 Fell Cleaves + 1 Inner Chaos during its window. That's more than Equilibrium when it crits, so it's quite powerful. It certainly helps your healers out in a lot of situations.

When you aren't the main tank though, the self-healing aspect on yourself becomes useless. Why bother healing yourself? Outside of specific mechanics, you will only be getting hit by AoE damage, which the rest of the party is also getting hit by. Meaning healers will be having to heal everyone by the same amount. You healing yourself won't make a difference. This makes me treat NF as a cooldown to be used on the main tank during tank busters, especially in certain situations where I can tell the healers are struggling. But that's just 10% damage reduction. 10%...

Our level 76 is not only a utility, but it is ONLY a utility during raids and dungeons. Not only that, but if everyone dies, it suddenly becomes useless. This is the main issue I have with this. A heal of 60k won't make you invincible. That's like 3-4 autoattacks from the boss. Give me a break with that bullshit argument. Plus even if you use it off of cooldown, you won't have enough beast gauge to get the same 60k heal every time, so realistically on average it's more of a 50k heal.

Bottom line is, there is absolutely no reason to keep NF from being able to be used on yourself.

As it stands now:
If you're MT, you use it on someone else to heal yourself.
If you're OT, you use it on the MT to help with mitigation.

Now imagine if you can cast it on yourself. What would change?!
If you're MT, you just use it on yourself to heal yourself.
If you're OT, you still put it on the MT to help with mitigation. What are you gonna put it on yourself for? You're probably already full HP and any extra AoE damage will be handled by healers!

There is just literally no valid arguments against this. It wouldn't change the way the ability is used. It wouldn't make Warriors invincible during fights. It would just be a wonderful QoL change that every Warrior player would appreciate.

Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

snip

OK so a couple of things. First off, being able to cast it on yourself wouldn't stop NF from being the "support ability" that it currently is. I see the point you're making about it being linked with Raw Intuition, but that's still not a very good argument.

It sort of feels like you're trying to argue that because Raw Intuition is linked with NF, then you should never have a reason to use NF over Raw Intuition when you're alone. I disagree with this - there are times when I want to get extra mitigation from a tank buster, over being able to heal myself later. In fact, there are times where I NEED the extra 20% mitigation. I think this is a good option. It was like being able to switch to Defiance and use Inner Beast back in the day, when a healer was down and you didn't have enough HP to live through the incoming tank buster, despite having used Vengeance/Rampart/Thrill.

As for NF being "so good", I really don't see what your point is here. You're saying it's "so good" as if it's a game-breaking ability. It's not. It's a level 76 ability, it's supposed to be good. It's supposed to have impact. And right now, it does... but in cases where you're playing by yourself or trying to finish off the last 2% HP from a boss, it becomes useless. And I just don't see why it should have to be like that.

Here's another perspective - imagine if The Blackest Night or Clemency were only able to be used on party members. Maybe you can make a case towards TBN since it is tied to DRK's damage, but not Clemency.

Not sure why whisky keeps saying people will stop using nf as an ot ability if it has its target requirement removed. The action is so clunky people are still going to macro it and just add one line of code for target self. So nothing changes. Good to u for being able to use this clunky ass action without a macro and still able to get 3 cleaves in it.

Nf not being able to target self is a bigger problem in frontlines also. Although, feast is all SE cares about apparently.

War got the short end of the stick this xpac. Bad design all over, with bare minimum functionality/balance as the only goal. This was especially apparent in pvp early on when war never had to even touch combo button, and had effectively zero self heal in frontlines. But it was fine in feast cuz of healer, so it was all good... right?

Se showed no care for fun or interesting gameplay at all with war. Rushed it and it shows. At this point, debating nf is moot cuz they wont touch it til 6.0 so they dont have to work to keep things balanced.

Kinda like how sch launched without any aetherflow dps spender and had to throw away heals to hit aether again for mana. Its like no one at se played some of the jobs before launch or cared about how unfun or clunky some the changed they made are.

Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

Sure there is. It's a support-oriented ability that was (poorly) designed for use in group play.

Then we ought to see either of two paths:

1. Nascent Flash becomes more vital to support than to self-sustain, thus fitting in with other "support" abilities that are actually and/or solely used as such, or
2. They treat Nascent as the outlier it is, simply giving the choice between a brief Bloodbath (that can also target allies instead) or percentile mitigation.

Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

I'm all for giving WAR some self healing action to assist in solo duties and extra mitigation, I just don't think using NF is the best way to do it because it diminishes the dynamic between it and RI even more. I mean, I'd rather them change RI to support and have NF as our self-heal a la 2.0 Inner Beast. Or nix the party support altogether and give us our damage back.

You do have a self-heal. Multiple even. Storm's Path, Thrill of Battle and Equilibrium are all self-heals.

Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Then we ought to see either of two paths:

1. Nascent Flash becomes more vital to support than to self-sustain, thus fitting in with other "support" abilities that are actually and/or solely used as such, or
2. They treat Nascent as the outlier it is, simply giving the choice between a brief Bloodbath (that can also target allies instead) or percentile mitigation.

Option 3: Raw Intuition is decrease to 10% mitigation but has the Bloodbath effect added.

The following option is one that Warriors will hate but make things as they are intended:
Option 4: Nascent Flash's self healing is removed insuring the Raw Intuition is used as the short mitigation and Nascent Flash as the party support buff.

Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

Option 3: Raw Intuition is decrease to 10% mitigation but has the Bloodbath effect added.

Bloodbath is only 20% of damage dealt converted to HP, Nascent Flash is 50% for the user. Even if you have 10% mitigation this would still leave RI inferior to Nascent. Frankly, I think the only viable solution to make both abilities useful in their own rights would be to unlink their cooldowns from one another, because unless RI either gets massively buffed, NF gets massively nerfed, or their cooldowns are no longer linked together, RI will keep its position of almost never being used due to almost never being superior to NF.