nin and dnc buffs when?

[HyoMinPark]

during raid patch?
cause our friendly information measuring tool tells me that these two classes need some love.

Dnc feels alright but dmg tampers off and sometimes feels kinda of sluggish with flourish and all those attacks and feel saber dance needs to be off gcd basically serves the same purpose as a mch Ricochet but fights with other cds of course it should be priority.

also before SUPPORT class other then BLM and sam Every class throws out a large amount or equal supporting buffs most of dnc is literally limited to another dps which should be a sam or blm. in a sense it should be a mix of being a ranged version of dragoon now im not asking for top dmg im just asking for not terrible dmg

As far as I’m aware, we do not yet know what the raid DPS of NIN and DNC are. The only numbers I have seen are numbers from Titania EX’s SSS dummy, which are not an adequate measure of anything other than what a job can do on a striking dummy, because it looks only at personal damage—and this is not adequate for any job that brings party buffs, since you also want to consider rDPS when you look at those jobs.

It’s not all about personal DPS when it comes to balancing (especially with buff jobs); you need to consider raid DPS with regards to these jobs as well. Lower personal damage (such as NIN or DNC) can be easily made up for with high raid contribution. It’s the reason why NIN has been meta since its inception—despite having some of the lowest personal damage, Trick Attack has been one of the strongest raid buffs. In Alphascape, it could give up to 1,000 rDPS to a good group, for example.


DNC in particular should not be judged on dummy parses because these SSS numbers I have seen give no benefit to the DNC when it comes to Esprit generation. Given how Esprit works, striking dummy targets are the worst way to judge the job’s damage—there is no way for DNC to get the full benefits from Esprit and Saber Dance because we cannot Closed Position a dance partner (so no Esprit generation there for the entire duration of the dummy parse) AND it also does not consider the Esprit buff Technical Finish gives to party members—so that’s 20 seconds of Esprit on 7 other people every 120 seconds that is also not being considered. This is all talk about the personal damage gains to DNC. It’s not even considering the buffs of Standard Finish and Technical Finish—which would also need to be taken into consideration for them.

BRD was in a similar spot in SB—despite the SSS dummies not being tuned with the +5% piercing in mind, BRD relied so heavily on critical hit buffs that that alone impacted dummy parses. Take away Litany and Chain Strategem, and BRD’s damage dropped because of reduced proc rates (which meant reduced damage). Conversely, give them Litany and Chain, and their damage skyrocketed because of more procs (and more damage as a result). Especially with the more critical hit they could stack on their gear and melds. With regards to rDPS gains, BRD was bringing quite a bit of rDPS from its passive crit, Foe’s, and Battle Voice—usually netting ~300 rDPS a piece in Alphascape, if not more. This contribution to the raid made up for its lower personal damage compared to other jobs.



I’d say we really need more data on the total raid contribution of the jobs before we can really make any sort of judgment regarding buffing them. Because it’s not all about personal damage when it comes to jobs like NIN and DNC.