NIN is undertuned.

[ForteNightshade]

I've said it in other threads as well, but I'd be fine if they nerfed TA hard, we've been held back by this ability for far too long.

I think the most logical changes would be something like this:

-Slight buff to our 1-2-3 AE combo to compensate for dripping blade loss (AE was actually nerfed in overall potency from SB).
-Removing TA raid utility, but increasing the damage it does to NIN only, or alternatively, nerfing it to 5% for raid/15% for NIN.
-Changing Hyosho Ranryu to work off Fuma instead of Hyoton.
-Bunshin rework and/or buff.

This still doesn't entirely fix the problem with using Raiton > Fuma and the clipping it causes, but there isn't much they could do there other than buffing Raiton so hard it makes the clipping worth it, or returning dripping blades in some form so we go back to Fuma. Either way, I'm more frustrated with trying to fit x2 Kassatsu/x2 Hyosho in our TA windows, and Bunshin being the biggest let down of a lifetime.

I sincerely doubt they will remove Trick as that essentially turns Ninja into Samurai. If they were going to make such a drastic change, it would have happened with 5.0's release. Being brought down to 5% or having Trick's CD moved to 120s would suffice. That essentially makes it comparable to Monk and Dragoon. As for Mudras. I rather like the idea posted earlier of scaling each one back and removing Fuma outright. That solves the clipping issue of Raiton and lessens the loss for hard casting Suiton and Doton. I still think Meisu needs a look but at least this would amount to something. Alas, I think if they were going to do anything to Trick, they would have already.

[Nexxus]

I wouldn't mind losing trick attack if i could output more damage.
As for now, Ranged (except dancer) can deal more amount of damage, being in a safe spot, no positionals required, delivering some buff, dragoon can also deal massive amount of damage and give a buff to someone.
Ninja lack dps, either make his Trick Attack an AoE debuff and make it to last longer with higher bonus for ourself.

[Telefrag]

To be fair, I think a lot of people valued trick too highly in PF groups or low end statics. There are only specific environments where it was mandatory and a group could take full advantage of it's window.

So I don't know if SE is really just keeping NIN down in the dumps and probably JUST forgot to put something to replace dripping blades trait.

I don't even think it's really that much an issue that TA needs to keep NIN at the complete bottom for the CPM it requires nowdays. To be honest though I could care less as long as the dmg is okay, and it's fun to play.

Really I think the only things that need adjustments are probably bushin having it's ninki cost removed (I don't get why they feel like they need 3 abilities for ninki), and probably double in CD timer. I also think meisui and suiton interaction isn't good to overlap between TA, though this probably was a conscious decision on SE's part because they gave you a 30 second suiton buff.

What I could see SE doing is just give them a change or two to meisui and bushin, I think I wouldn't care that the dps was a bit of a dip from ranged dps. But let's be real, if ranged dps consistently outdoes melee without uptime requirements, and only 1 melee is needed because of buff and LB changes, some melee is gonna get the AXE.

[Orbus]

I've never liked trick attack or the classes over reliance on it.
It's the shining poster child of over relied upon raid support skills that they went to so much trouble to nerf or remove, but it's the one thing they didn't touch.

If they want to keep the ninja class performing a three ring circus act then their damage needs to be much, much higher to show for it and not "made up" with trick attack (which it doesn't do in the first place) in a theoretical 24-man raid setting with unrealistic expectations in all but the top 1% of players.

[Typhoria]

First of ALL, why would this ever be in the works. Going down to 2 steps for Shadowfang upkeep was a blessing in itself. The point of ARMOR CRUSH and Aoelian Edge being seperated is because there's a decision to be made. The same reason you go for Shadowfang after Spinning Edge. This is not a design flaw.

The decision you mention is the illusion of choice. There is no situation where you would willingly let Huton fall off. Likewise the only reason to not keep Shadow Fang up would be if the target is about to die.
Adding Armor Crush after Shadow Fang is both a convenience and an overall potency over time increase.

[Carstien]

I wouldn't put too much faith in a chart that says WHM is doing more DPS than tanks.

Thing is, look at flogs. Highest whm is actually doing more damage than highest tanks. Don't put faith in sss, but at least look stuff up.

[Aomine1992]

What I could see SE doing is just give them a change or two to meisui and bushin, I think I wouldn't care that the dps was a bit of a dip from ranged dps. But let's be real, if ranged dps consistently outdoes melee without uptime requirements, and only 1 melee is needed because of buff and LB changes, some melee is gonna get the AXE.

This can be a bit worrisome just look at the ex trials now, BRDs, BLMs, SMNs and MCHs are doing just as much or even more then some melee...without having to worry about anything at all (Besides the occasional mechanic) lol meanwhile innocence is forever spinning out of my positional lol..

[Carstien]

This can be a bit worrisome just look at the ex trials now, BRDs, BLMs, SMNs and MCHs are doing just as much or even more then some melee...without having to worry about anything at all (Besides the occasional mechanic) lol meanwhile innocence is forever spinning out of my positional lol..

True north? I agree, nin needs a buff but for the love of god man, true north.

[Aomine1992]

True north? I agree, nin needs a buff but for the love of god man, true north.

Obviously lol why say that like I don’t know it exist. It was more on the joking side of things positional arnt an issue it’s really in the demand of uptime.

[TheGrimace]

I came here to complain about how bad Ten-Chi-Jin still feels. There seem to be a lot more enemies that use huge area attacks in this expansion, and being unable to move during TCJ is more of a detriment than ever. Then I see this thread. Ugh.

I think Ninja is in a rough spot right now. Removing the hate management skills was necessary for simplifying tanks' changes, but that was a big part of Ninja's utility. The lack of Dripping Blades and other issues with clipping are problematic and I hope that SE does decide to buff the job. I just hope it doesn't take them as long as it took to proceed with their Machinist adjustments...