The Problem with Paladin

[Peptaru]

I'm so very glad to have seen a couple people mention the gear instead of the abilities. The Pld JSE stuff is awful! same defense as cobalt, yes except the cuirass, but... that's only NQ COBALT. If you have a +1 set, which is now fairly easy to do, even single melded it is going to destroy Pld JSE in terms of damage mitigation. The Cobalt also offering a decent HP boost just from the boots with one HP materia in them alone. The new accessories do help Pld, what with the cure potency and mag crit jewelry, but that means you have to sacrifice some HP or +30 (say for tanking sake) Vit on your rings.... I like Pld, I can manage mp well enough i suppose... If it had a bit more damage mitigation then MP management would be much more, well.... managable. I do NOT think MP should be easy to keep up and i like needing support jobs to tank well with Pld, but for all my love of Pld, Gladiator is still the better tank. That said.... Warrior > Gladiator now.

[LicontAshontear]

I wish a Dev would get in here and give us some feedback as to WHY pld is so horrible. But i know it will never happen.

[Agoven]

JOBS were meant for PARTY PLAY...With a BARD in party = No MP issues.

That is all.

[Agoven]

Anyone like PLD? CAUSE I REALLY DO AND I DON'T THINK ANYTHING NEEDS TO CHANGE ABOUT THE JOB!

By the way...Battle classes/jobs are still in the tweak...

Only Mage classes have been confirmed to be in their semi-final state as they will be in 2.0. By the way I love how mage classes play now. I love how moving causes spell cancellation. It's so much FUN NOW!

...and that is all I had to say.

[Andrien]

JOBS were meant for PARTY PLAY...With a BARD in party = No MP issues.

That is all.

Replace the PLD with a GLA, and you wont need a Bard for MP refresh.

Anyone like PLD? CAUSE I REALLY DO AND I DON'T THINK ANYTHING NEEDS TO CHANGE ABOUT THE JOB!

By the way...Battle classes/jobs are still in the tweak...

Only Mage classes have been confirmed to be in their semi-final state as they will be in 2.0. By the way I love how mage classes play now. I love how moving causes spell cancellation. It's so much FUN NOW!

...and that is all I had to say.

You didn't read much of the thread have you? You should try it out next time before you post a tantrum.

The majority of this discussion is about anything a PLD can do a GLA can do better. There is not much a PLD can do to outshine a GLA or a WAR when it comes to tanking which it is its role.

[Zenaku]

Warrior seem like a better tank then PLD -.- which is pretty sad when PLD should out do the warrior in tanking. Pretty much warrior out does PLD and does awesome DMG.

[Knives]

Hmm... This is interesting indeed, I think actually it would be practical if Paladin gained a trait that enhanced Aegis Boon to recover comparable MP to the HP is regenerates upon blocking and to, as you said before, enhance Outmaneuver's block rate and MP recovery.

Even still, I feel like Paladin was always meant to tank along side a Warrior, not exclusively. It's the 1-on-1 tank that can heal the other guy too, and was never meant to heal just himself. It's the pre-healer that uses his MP up at the start of a battle to ease the burdon of hate on the healer by healing the main tank. Holy Succor is a case in point imo. That's just what I'm beginning to think though, based on the job's blatent lack of real enmity tools.

[Phobos]

Replace the PLD with a GLA, and you wont need a Bard for MP refresh.



You didn't read much of the thread have you? You should try it out next time before you post a tantrum.

The majority of this discussion is about anything a PLD can do a GLA can do better. There is not much a PLD can do to outshine a GLA or a WAR when it comes to tanking which it is its role.

Warrior seem like a better tank then PLD -.- which is pretty sad when PLD should out do the warrior in tanking. Pretty much warrior out does PLD and does awesome DMG.

These two posts pretty much sum up the thread, for the last few people that seem to ignore it. Yes, PLD uses MP better etc. One person I saw complain about casting interrupts, I have not run into such an issue. The real issue is as these two mention (and is twofold).

Regardless of if you have a bard or not (which a lot of replies suggested), GLA has better abilities for tanking. PLD offers hardly anything as the only ability that is not situational or doesn't have a huge recast time is Holy Succor, which while some suggest can be used to generate extra enmity, GLA can still use MP with cure, it's just a less potent spell. People saying they're having an easier time on PLD, I would say it's likely a placebo effect from being in a party with a WHM and a BRD, and to test that you could try the fight on GLA and PLD with the same gear to see for yourself. Yes, the new abilities are neat, but on GLA I will only miss Holy Succor and Spirits Within - both of which cannot really be used too frequently.

The second problem, as the second post I am quoting brings up and the first post mentions, is that WAR is in fact better than both PLD and GLA at tanking regardless. I do not want WAR nerfed or anything, I actually haven't seen anyone request that at all. It is a bit odd though that one of the DD's is better at keeping hate and taking damage because of their HP boost rather than loss, equally high defense, and a front weaponskil combo with actual useful combo bonuses to survival and enmity.

[tachi]

From my understanding the biggest boost from the jobs is being able to equip the job specific gear, and the extra abilities. Each job was offered either exceptionally boosted gear (WHM set) or specific new abilities like the extra songs on BRD, or ws's on LNC, nukes on BLM+convert, PLD didn't get any extra enmity specific abilites except holy succor.

The question is how much enmity does holy succor generate, I know it can cure a lot of total HP from target + self, this could be generating the equivalent enmity of 2 provokes (depending if it uses enmity like cure 75% cured point for point into enmity generated) Also figuring if the healing potency can raise this and the fact that it can be nearly spammed barring MP limits it can really pump up a ton of enmity very quickly.

From a limited amount of testing I think we just don't fully understand the PLD's potential as a community yet.

[AreeyaJaidee]

I'd like to see a GLA Cover a mage when Great Buffalo drops hate when -20%HP. Then use Holy Succor to simultaneously replenish a party members HP and tanks HP at the same time thus effectively contributing to the party as more than a static meat shield whilst procuring more enmity.

I also personally like the fact that Divine Veil utilizes PLD as a satelite cure in order to take some hate burden off of a mage that has to cure heavy.

Hallowed Ground is a good "oh shit" button imo.

PLD also has a nice dmg output boost over GLA.

Last time i checked, key parts of being a tank were: resilience, a method with which to sustain enmity, and the know how to effectively combine the last two with proper positional awareness.

PLD isn't flawed: it is more geared for survival than GLA could ever hope to be. Ppl continue to make comments about MP vs. Second Wind and such, however they completely miss or AVOID the utility of Holy Succor in an attempt to justify their argument. Because being seen by the public as "right" is COOL and gives awesome ego boost so ppl will (respect?) you more.

Seems like everyone ranting about how PLD sucks should really be writing a thread about how user error dilutes the hard work and legitimacy of most well working concepts.

Jobs all have their own utility. SE said from the start that classes would still be just as capable of their role and weren't becoming obsolete. So what is everyone so afraid of? Change?

Well the majority already voted for change and now its here once again. Deal with it.