The Problem with Paladin

[Gold_Lion]

A problem I find also is casting heals get interrupted in crowd control situations with mobs hitting you...blocks atleast should negate this

[Raagnar]

I thought this same problem with PLD while tanking final fights for mnk drg and brd. I was having a hard time controlling the situations so I changed back to gladiator and tanked them all just fine, I felt like GLA could hold hate as well but i also had access to invigorate, second wind, sanguine rite, and featherfoot which made it so much easier to recover, kite, and hold hate in general.

I thought to myself this is just because PLD is new and I dont have enough practice with it, but I see Im not the only one who felt PLD was lackluster.

[Endemerrin]

I feel squisher on my Paladin than I do on my Warrior. In fact, I tanked the entirety of Darkhold on my Warrior without breaking a sweat. Fastest speed run I've done to date, too. Didn't even so much as drop into yellow tanking Batraal.

Since then, and even before then, I've started tanking everything on Warrior. Having played Paladin for the first few days after unlocking on day 1 of the patch, I honestly enjoy Warrior more. I feel safer tanking as a Warrior than I do as a Paladin. My groups have been far more successful with me on Warrior, too.

[FraenirVolsung]

I know some may disagree, but I feel like this is the simplest way to put how PLD has been introduced. I think you lose more going from Gladiator to Paladin than you gain going from Gladiator to Paladin. I just don't hear the same concerns from other classes/jobs. WHM is obviously optimized for party play. BRD is obviously optimized for party play. WAR, DRG, MNK, and BLM all seem to have huge advantages over their class counterparts in most party situations (BLM not having access to Cure is one negative). It seems the more PLDs I talk to the more I find that feel like GLA is just as good if not better in both solo and party play. To me, that's the problem with Paladin as the title of the thread suggests. Paladin has some very nice skills and brings a few new wrinkles to tanking, but I can't see how Paladin is any more optimized for party play than Gladiator is.

[elreed]

While your points are valid, requirements have simply shifted from:

Need: Tank, Healer, BLMs (or whatever you want)

to:

Need: Paladin, Healer, Bard, Warrior, etc.

The requirements are more spread out, but you still have specific classes/jobs you're looking to fill.

Also GLA > PLD is more my point, as the first reply mentions

Well i felt that PLD needs more AoE WS not too much maybe one WS and phalanx being AoE, but i feel pld is better holding hate and dmg than gld, u have a lot of stuff to resist dmg at ur disposal, the thing is to have more jobs involved and not the boring Ifrit setup, tank+conjurer x2 + Thm's

[LicontAshontear]

I havn't read every post in this thread (9 pages Ef that) but I read the first page of posts, and while your points are valid, I do not belive they would "fix" paladin.

Lets look at what was promised to us when paladin was supposed to come out.

correct me if I'm wrong but I'm positive Yoshi said that PLD would get less HP, which we did get, and a major boost in Defense. Lets examine this so called "boost" in defense. By switching to PLD you lose 10 str and gain 10 vit. Now this part might just be broken, I'm not sure, but defense does not go up at all. 10 vit? srsly? pathetic.

Now lets examine the PLD AF.

Gallant Surcoat - decent piece really, MP +40, MND +12, Healing magic potency +3, Enmity +3, Enhances Cover.

Now lets examine these stats and what they do for a PLD. Its rather obvious that this piece is intended to help the PLD heal himself, right? Right. Now...lets put this to good use.
*starts casting* ... *is the tank so got hit and interupted* ... *starts casting* ... *is the tank so got hit and interupted*

Wow that is so helpful! >.>;

Now lets examine something else, previous gear. I use Sentinel Cuirass.

Sentinel's Cuirass - HP+50, Vit +4, Mind +4, Block Rate +5. This piece of gear has the potential for materia, I have a +20 vit materia on it. so add +20 VIT.

Now lets examine this piece of gear. It has HP to help the tank live longer, it has vit on it to help the tank take less damage and live longer, it has mind incase the tank needs to heal himself and actually can get a spell off. It has block rate + so the tank has a higher chance to block incoming attacks thus taking less damage so he can live longer.

Now I don't know about you, but to me its rather clear which of these 2 is better. Sentinel's all the way.

All the other PLD af is the same way just about. Nothing super special about it. In fact it seems rather backwards to me.


Now lets look at the other AF for other jobs.

DRG --- I love drg, it is amazing, the AF is amazingly good. Lets examine it shall we.

Drachen Gauntlets - HP -30 (not a bad thing, not good, but not bad either) Attack Power +40 (holy s**t balls wtf?!) -10 enmity (again holy s**t balls wtf?!)

Wit the exception of the hp- this is amazing! It gives -enmity to take less hate and dps longer/harder (yes yes go ahead and laugh) and +40 attack power!

Now...lets look at BLM.

Wizard's Gloves - HP --30 (again not good, but not bad either) Magic Acc +5 Magic Crit Potency +65 (+65!?! *drool*) Enmity -10 (see previous statement about crit potency lol)

I could go on and on and on about this. But I'm not going to.

Suffice to say PLD has alot of problems, MP management is just one of them.

Sad panda face for PLD

Crying tears of joy for DRG

[SpringLeaf]

How do I keep this topic on the hot topic pages? I couldn't agree more. PLD just doesn't add up to warrior like it should.

[Jenday]

yes i agree, the AF is sub par, has 0 HP on it, and is all around an average job compared to the other jobs, needs an overhaul next patch.

Biggest gripe is the lackluster AF compared to others tho, get 2 or 3 vit here and there, like that does anything, the same def as cobalt, 10-20 mp or so, when spells cost 150+, this doesn't make a difference, the enmity is nice but thats all it really has going for it besides looks.. my 2 cents.

[HoolieWho]

I would like to see Outmaneuver give better MP returns and I also like the idea of Spirit's Within returning MP instead of doing extra damage. This is because I actually have a good use for MP on PLD, unlike on GLA. I would tank Ifrit and barely touch my MP on GLA because of Second Wind and the weakness of Cure.

It seems clear to me that Holy Succor is to be cast primarily on other party members and I welcome it for that. If a party member has hate and I don't have Flash or Provoke up, now I have a good tool to help them where GLA has nothing. Two tools if you add in Cover. I haven't checked to see what kind of regen Divine Veil gives, but it seems designed so melee can stand near the tank where AOEs happen and get some relief (ex. MNK/PUG against Ifrit's Sear).

So far since the patch I have done mostly AF fights and a few tries against the Princess in Cutter's Cry. For these short fights you don't have MP issues. I can see in a long fight like Ifrit that some kind of MP recovery tool even on a 15 min timer would be welcome. Something like PLD had in FFXI where PLD could swap TP for MP.

I have not done a kited fight on PLD yet, but I can see GLA being superior there.

[Xylotrupes]

I'd like to see Paldins getting MP from Covering other People. The more damage you take for them the more MP you get in return. Sure it won't work without a Party and without others being hit but I think it would be fun ;D