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  1. #1
    Player
    X89K1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    21
    Character
    Calamitas Clone
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 2

    Request: Could Lucid Dreaming's Enmity Drop be Re-implemented?

    With the change to tank aggro now, in theory the need for DPS/Healers to control their enmity is gone. However, I've noticed that when a tank dies and leaves aggro on them, they now have no options aside from stopping attacking/healing for reducing their enmity to avoid death by auto-attacks or tankbusters.
    If the enmity drop is re-implemented, this would allow the DPS/Healer with aggro to save themselves, since instead of receiving all auto attacks while a tank tries to get aggro back, the attacks can instead be spread over multiple party members.

    4 July 2019 Edit:
    Thank you all for your responses so far.
    To further discussion, here is another question based on the above case scenario: Should the highest damage DPS be punished for a tank's death? In the event that the tank with aggro on the boss dies, the DPS outputting the most is going to be the one to die if the healers or co-tank(s) do not notice, since they will be generating the most aggro, whether they want to or not.
    (17)
    Last edited by X89K1; 07-05-2019 at 01:52 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Mistyregions's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    424
    Character
    Misty Regions
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Step 1, don't have the tank die
    (6)

  3. #3
    Player
    TankHunter678's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    873
    Character
    Selena Zensh
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Give Diversion back as well, and the enmity drop on the SAM specific self heal. We may not need to manage our aggro as much as before, however there are still situations where it is needed. Throwing Ultimatum as a Tank Role Skill again would also be helpful for the cases of the tank died and got ressed.
    (11)

  4. #4
    Player
    Hash_Browns's Avatar
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    Mar 2019
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    788
    Character
    Hash Browns
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 80
    Ahh, I see the issue here. The tank isn't getting healed, and thus, can not hold aggro.
    (10)

  5. #5
    Player
    TankHunter678's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    873
    Character
    Selena Zensh
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Hash_Browns View Post
    Ahh, I see the issue here. The tank isn't getting healed, and thus, can not hold aggro.
    More cases of the tank or healer failed positioning and got clobbered. Also times where the tank did not pop a defensive when they should have and got nuked or the healer was running low on MP, be it because DPS keep dying to mechanics and the Healer has to keep ressing them, the healer is undergeared and struggling with the damage intake, or the healer wound up over DPSing because at the time the damage intake was not enough and just saw a nasty spike. There is also cases where the Tank just plain got caught in too many AoEs dropped on them by panicking players scattering about in larger group content.
    (16)

  6. #6
    Player
    Mistyregions's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    424
    Character
    Misty Regions
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by TankHunter678 View Post
    More cases of the tank or healer failed positioning and got clobbered. Also times where the tank did not pop a defensive when they should have and got nuked or the healer was running low on MP, be it because DPS keep dying to mechanics and the Healer has to keep ressing them, the healer is undergeared and struggling with the damage intake, or the healer wound up over DPSing because at the time the damage intake was not enough and just saw a nasty spike. There is also cases where the Tank just plain got caught in too many AoEs dropped on them by panicking players scattering about in larger group content.
    So what you are saying is the the game is more punishing for lack of player skill? The lack of tanking skills, healer MP management and lack of DPS avoidance?

    So what your saying is the game punishes you more and you dont like it? Would you like the game to be easier?
    (2)

  7. #7
    Player
    X89K1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    21
    Character
    Calamitas Clone
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 2
    I was just thinking, since most DPS do not have access to sustained self healing, it would help their survival if they had an option besides spamming a macro saying they have aggro and hoping the healers/tanks notice.
    If it would be too forgiving for them to have that option, okay, valid counter-argument.
    (3)

  8. #8
    Player
    Mistyregions's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    424
    Character
    Misty Regions
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by X89K1 View Post
    I was just thinking, since most DPS do not have access to sustained self healing, it would help their survival if they had an option besides spamming a macro saying they have aggro and hoping the healers/tanks notice.
    If it would be too forgiving for them to have that option, okay, valid counter-argument.
    What? There is no way a DPS can pull aggro off a tank if he has his stance on. And as far as self healing for dps, I mean dont get hit by mechanics and the healers are complaining about "over healing people" and "not enough to heal" then they can just heal. I don't know what your asking for here, the game punishes you harder for lack of skill, that's exactly what yoshi p said. That the jobs performce comes from player skill, you lack it and the game punishes you. So what do you want, it to be easier?
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player
    TankHunter678's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    873
    Character
    Selena Zensh
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Mistyregions View Post
    So what you are saying is the the game is more punishing for lack of player skill? The lack of tanking skills, healer MP management and lack of DPS avoidance?

    So what your saying is the game punishes you more and you dont like it? Would you like the game to be easier?
    I am saying it is better to have the tools even if they are niche and not used often then to not have them and need them. Situations can and do happen because not everyone is perfect and on the same wavelength. There is a variance in skill levels and sometimes the boss just drops tons aoes that are unavoidable and placed by players. I've seen tanks do everything right and still die because of things outside of their control due to how people scatter trying to get away from other AoE's while converging their own with others.
    (3)

  10. #10
    Player
    Mistyregions's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    424
    Character
    Misty Regions
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by TankHunter678 View Post
    I am saying it is better to have the tools even if they are niche and not used often then to not have them and need them. Situations can and do happen because not everyone is perfect and on the same wavelength. There is a variance in skill levels and sometimes the boss just drops tons aoes that are unavoidable and placed by players. I've seen tanks do everything right and still die because of things outside of their control due to how people scatter trying to get away from other AoE's while converging their own with others.
    Those tools make it easier, so that a hard no. I believe most can agree everything is already easy.

    Second everyone needs to get on the same wavelength, this is a team sport not and individual competition. Communicate and figure out where to AOEs go and where to place them, that's just a corps component of the game.

    We adapt to the game or we get punished by it, this is how the game is played. Take time to learn and discuss it with your party members, take time to learn and it will be easy.
    (2)

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