What have you done?

[Nedkel]

If SE make a rework that make most of his old community have to move to another job then it's a problem and a big one no matter how you look at it and you like the new version BCS is a lack of respect for all the ppl who really enjoy the job in the past in his good and bad moments, noone should have to wait 2 years for the next expansion hopping for fixed that come or not.

Other games rework characters/classes all the time, very often completely rebuilding it from scratch.
If a rework forces people to change their playing habits, then its a good rework. Some people will jump to other thing and other peeps will go play the reworked stuff.
A never ending cycle of changes is what keeps online games alive.
I love new DRK, its the faster version of 4.0 PLD with some WAR flavour.

[Ignimortis]

Other games rework characters/classes all the time, very often completely rebuilding it from scratch.
If a rework forces people to change their playing habits, then its a good rework. Some people will jump to other thing and other peeps will go play the reworked stuff.
A never ending cycle of changes is what keeps online games alive.
I love new DRK, its the faster version of 4.0 PLD with some WAR flavour.

Where's the DRK then? You know, the fast-paced, high-APM tank who has to manage MP extensively? Because all I see now in 5.0's DRK is "well, we're kinda like WAR now, but with less big numbers".

[Nedkel]

Where's the DRK then? You know, the fast-paced, high-APM tank who has to manage MP extensively? Because all I see now in 5.0's DRK is "well, we're kinda like WAR now, but with less big numbers".

Its gone because it was bad and it would be even worse in comparison to current PLD and War if it stayed the same way.
Action per minute doesnt mean a lot if its one button being pressed multiple times in that minute that is only used to increase damage for action used.

Why do you care about DRK? Paladins and Warriors are still better, so you should and have to play them considering that you solely care about performance and not gameplay. So let those who actually care about gameplay criticize the current DRK.

You missed the point.
If job works (it does) then it is fine, developer wont go back to the old version just because there are people who do not like the gameplay of the reworked job that is in a good shape in terms of performance.

If DRK flow and personal style was good in the past why change it at all? It have problems like the rest of the jobs in the game for sure but most ppl claim HW was and is still the best version of the job with is everything what we love and is not anymore so this rework was unjustified and the backslash from the old mains is well deserved.

There was always something to complain about and dev did listen to all these complaints.
They took now different approach because it wasnt working well, and they did best thing they could have done for this job by just ignoring those who have no idea what they really want. HW was the best if you look at it from rose glasses, there were people complaining about it, were they wrong or right? Apparently SB DRK was all fine and good, then why it wasnt played that much and people complained about everything? It came back to life after a series of buffs, but the design was flawed to the core and i cant imagine SB DRK going into ShB without overhaul.

[Ignimortis]

Its gone because it was bad and it would be even worse in comparison to current PLD and War if it stayed the same way.
Action per minute doesnt mean a lot if its one button being pressed multiple times in that minute.

So you're forgetting about Blood Weapon giving weaponskill haste and lasting up to 23 seconds? You could have it up for 38 seconds per every 80 seconds, in fact. And that was DRK's mechanical identity - you cared about your mana expenditures and often had combos at 2.15 recast timers instead of that sluggish 2.38 or something. That was something to build upon (Darkside gives haste, but only lasts for 20 seconds, for instance, so you have to actively refresh it and watch your mana), and instead we got WAR-lite. It's not bad design, you might not like it, but you can go play WAR.

[shao32]

There was always something to complain about and dev did listen to all these complaints.
They took now different approach because it wasnt working well, and they did best thing they could have done for this job by just ignoring those who have no idea what they really want. HW was the best if you look at it from rose glasses, there were people complaining about it, were they wrong or right? Apparently SB DRK was all fine and good, then why it wasnt played that much and people complained about everything? It came back to life after a series of buffs, but the design was flawed to the core and i cant imagine SB DRK going into ShB without overhaul.

they didn't listen at all, in SB lyth and chrono make remakle good feedback threads with the problems and the direction they should take to make the job better at the same time we respect the job gameplay, the devs just ignore everything what we say, they just RIP every DRK mechanic and make it a pseudo WAR and it's insulting.

there is a diference on complaing about performance and complaing about gameplay, DRKs complaing in SB bcs the job was heavily underpowered compared to the other 2 and wasn't until 4.3 the job finally get some necesary buffs, in HW the job remaind unchanged all the expansion bcs was perfect, there was nothing wrong with DRK play style, dark arts being a bit to spamy? yeah but only bcs we don't have other options to spend our MP and we asked for more options so DA didn't get annoying for some ppl and they remove it.

this "rework" it's a clear proof that the devs partially listen and they take the lazy and easy way to dealt with it by giving a middle finger to many DRK mains tha love the job.

[jetfire117]

Where's the DRK then? You know, the fast-paced, high-APM tank who has to manage MP extensively? Because all I see now in 5.0's DRK is "well, we're kinda like WAR now, but with less big numbers".

Died when stormblood came out.

[shao32]

Other games rework characters/classes all the time, very often completely rebuilding it from scratch.
If a rework forces people to change their playing habits, then its a good rework. Some people will jump to other thing and other peeps will go play the reworked stuff.
A never ending cycle of changes is what keeps online games alive.
I love new DRK, its the faster version of 4.0 PLD with some WAR flavour.

Other games don't have 17 different jobs with more incoming and most mmo they have a few jobs with different skill trees so ppl can pick what they want, FFXIV is not like that and every job feels unique and have a personal play style evolving that play style with every expansion except DRK since now for some reason have to be a copy of WAR.

If DRK flow and personal style was good in the past why change it at all? It have problems like the rest of the jobs in the game for sure but most ppl claim HW was and is still the best version of the job with is everything what we love and is not anymore so this rework was unjustified and the backslash from the old mains is well deserved.

[gman1311]

Other games don't have 17 different jobs with more incoming and most mmo they have a few jobs with different skill trees so ppl can pick what they want, FFXIV is not like that and every job feels unique and have a personal play style evolving that play style with every expansion except DRK since now for some reason have to be a copy of WAR.

If DRK flow and personal style was good in the past why change it at all? It have problems like the rest of the jobs in the game for sure but most ppl claim HW was and is still the best version of the job with is everything what we love and is not anymore so this rework was unjustified and the backslash from the old mains is well deserved.

Then play another job (This is bait! Don’t blow your top off.)

[shao32]

Then play another job (This is bait! Don’t blow your top off.)

don't worry i dont bait, but i hope you understand a person like me that fell in love with DRK since 3.0 release in a way that i dind't care much being underpowered a entire expansion don't like this, hell i even save to buy the collector for the DRK statue, i just want DRK true flow back thats all.

[T-Owl]

Tanks are completely monotonous and boring now. TYVM.
pls enjoy your generic combo + generic aoe combo.

Use my aggro generating ability, hit a mob, go afk. Heaven forbid you'd have to actually put some effort into tanking.
The only fun part was being able to swap stances and play around with cooldowns while tanking... seriously im depressed. really really dissapointing.
Spam 3 buttons, pop a cooldown now n then, perhaps side step an orange circle from time to time, hooo weeee wow what a blast....

DRK is just a trainwreck, do you even test things before releasing?
Other tanks have just been gutted in the worst ways....
Basically you removed skills that generated aggro to trivialize aggro generation, and took away anything that made each job feel unique, sure the abilities are different colors and each job uses a diff weapon and has a different stance, but from a gameplay standpoint were all just blending together now.

I dont even want to think about how horrible level sync will be with this.
....could go on about it but i wont as nothing will change.

Very very sad seeing all MMO's go this route of simplifying things endlessly/needlessly
easy game = more subs = more money
dont believe me? just look at the plethora of cash grabs on the mogstore.

Have you ever played like content above leveling dungeons? The aggro combo was never used by most classes ever. Aggro in extreme and savage content was never a Tank job outside of the opener and tankswaps.
I think the only tank who ever used their aggro combo was DRK once during their opener, WAR didn't even needed it for its opener and PLD were never supposed to pull anyway. Outside of this, aggro was fully on the DPS to press their aggro reduction cooldowns once in a while.

The AOE is absolutely more fun with Stormblood, with all Tanks now having an aoe combo that generates their main ressource. In SB, the only tank who had a fun time doing AOE was the DRK, because he had a somewhat engaging aoe skillset.
On DRK, yeah, they are a trainweck. SE seriously needs to lower the CDs on Abyssal Drain and salted earth, give Bloodweapon its skillspeed buff back and even better, nerf the cooldown and make edge of darkness more often usable.

Is drk weak with current skill set the same way it was in stoormblood? No? Then the answer is, nothing is wrong with him despite some venom being spit by old drk mains, same old story with this job.
Developer had no other choice but to rework him completely again.

Why do you care about DRK? Paladins and Warriors are still better, so you should and have to play them considering that you solely care about performance and not gameplay. So let those who actually care about gameplay criticize the current DRK.