Revelations from SHADOWBRINGERS

[Zackneifein]

Sorry, but i fail to see Hydaelyn lies.

She never pretended to be the Goddess of Creation, she have never done anything malicious.
She is protecting the shards she created, but is it with malicious intent or to protect the lives of all people on them ? Again i fail to see what's evil in it.

It's clear now that she is not the "Good" incarnate, but it doesn't mean she have bad intention. And Mydgardsormr still trust her as an ally.

[Lauront]

Believe what you want. The information Emet-Selch has given us is enough to make me at least question the truth of her words, regardless of what Midgardsormr thinks. He is not some all knowing god, and he only can tell us of what he witnessed... and from an outsider's perspective in contrast to the Ascians, who lived through it all. He cannot penetrate her mind to read her intentions. I am not saying she is evil, but I certainly doubt the veracity of her claims and I also don't buy the codswallop she tried to sell about Zodiark being "evil". The Ascians' secretive nature and alignment with darkness, and their motives and actions without further context, certainly made them look "evil", and she seems to have exploited that.

She sounds like a failsafe that went out of control. That Emet-Selch freely admits that they are tempered by Zodiark, suggests we are under much the same effect, albeit it is a tempering of a different kind to the usual, possibly due to the Echo.

[Evraeh]

About Emet-Selch

The smile at the end, after asking us to remember them was... really something. At long last, he finally see us worthy, as the heir of the soul of his long lost friend. I find it quite beautiful

Same for me, I can't just forget him/ or at least just remember as asked.

I don't know for everyone, but this is the first time that I want an Ascian to live. I wish we didn't destroy his soul. I would just to get him back... he deserves more and really, a lot more. I found his story and his time with us so interesting and pleasant.

For MSQ ending :

I like Zenos yes, but really I would throw him away to get back Emet-Selch, he is a lot more touching. And I feel Zenos is going to do the 8th calamity and finally we didn't prevent nothing at the end.

Regarding Hydealyn and Zordiark :

Finally, we never saw any of them. Even Minfilia is just a messenger, so why Hydaelyn herself never come to give us more informations about it, when she was constantly after us during A Realm Reborn? I start to think she is the real one bad guy. Ascians are maybe extremists, but at the end they want the same thing, want to protect and get back their friends and the world where they lived.

Why are we going in the First ? For get back our friends, no? Why are we fighting till the end? For the sake and future of our world. We aren't different but only "Time" divides us.

And about the Calamity who destroys the first world. From where and from what did it start ? I mean, the Amaurotians said they can do everything with their magic/will... Did they start the calamity ? Cause of their powers and imagination ? I found that part of the story very troublefull.

We could be the "one" who left the council for some reasons. But if that so, why are we gone ? Cause the Council wanted to sacrifices to summon Zodiark ? Zodiark didn't do anything wrong against the planet, he saved everything left. He DID and saved them but summoned with so much "life" like all Primals who need aether. It's understandable why they wanted to sacrifice more to get some people back. I found the Council/Ascians right there, with their responsabilities, I think they found themself guilty. And the new "generation" didn't want to sacrifice more and wanted to live.
The story said, for the first time, the humanity was divided. But it's logic. That part is very sad, can't say who is wrong who is right.

But the real problem is the "Calamity", one Amaurotian said that was a sound from the planet who was destroying/troubling the order/will/magic and making people to fear - creating abominations. What that could be ? The planet was just bored/unhappy with her children ? Or could it be something else from "another world" who cause so much trouble?

[Zackneifein]

For MSQ ending :

I like Zenos yes, but really I would throw him away to get back Emet-Selch, he is a lot more touching. And I feel Zenos is going to do the 8th calamity and finally we didn't prevent nothing at the end.

I don't agree, he show disdain for Varis plan to use Black Rose, and it's the combinaison of the Flood of Light on the First and the use of Black Rose that caused the Calamity, and both of those are stopped.

About Hydaelyn :

I can complety understand that at least, we can doubt her words now.
But once again, what have she done evil, malicious or even in her purely own interest ? Maybe the Sundering and was it really wrong ?

I think, the sympathy we feel for Emet-Selch and the people of the original world make us want to see her as the big baddie, but it's just our sympathy for a lost race last moments.

Let's talk about why Hydaelyn was created :
Zodiark, if not Evil, doesn't seem to care about sacrifices.
The Council wanted to sacrifice the new generation to resurrect the previous one, i can only see that has a vicious circle and evil.

And it's Emet-Selch who say that to us, not Hydaelyn or one of her messenger trying to deceive us.

The Ascians litteraly doesn't care a shit about any "new humans" from the shattered worlds, with one exception, Emet-Slech, who at least tried to see interest in them during his eternal life (he said he tried and each time, humans have disappointed him), finally finding it in us. They even don't care about the "full" human that could result from the reunion of all shard since they still want to sacrifice them.

The only act of Hydaelyn we have seen, is that she try to protect the shard, and the life she created by doing it. Well protecting u and i'm not really against it.

Even while fighting the Flood of Light, we are helped by her Benediction, and by Minfillia.

And not being to "present" in the life of people from the shard, and not explaining everything about her can be explain by her "motherly" attitude.
You can't sacrifice to her people to resolve all your problems if you don't know it's a possibility.

[Fenral]

I can finally get my thoughts out in a way that makes sense.

Hydaelyn and Zodiark:

Certain maniacs here called this one a long time ago, but it's good to see those cards finally laid out in a way that feels like a legitimate revelation. It may even set the stage for a third option: joining the Ascians is off the table for good (not that it ever really was on the table, per se), but we at least now know that it's possible to break from Team Hydaelyn (should we need to) without necessarily dooming the world itself.

The Originals:

This also made a lot of sense with what scattered pieces we have, as well as confirming what had been suspected about the nature of Ascian titles. It wasn't hard to guess that Ardbert was a part of the same soul, or that Emet-Selch saw something special in the WoL's soul. That something apparently being a more-complete-than-usual soul. Is that the true nature of the Echo?

The Exarch:

Man, was that a long time coming. I spent most of the MSQ worried that they were bringing back and killing off the artist formerly known as G'raha Tia in an arc totally unconnected to the Allagans, just for irony points. The premeditated sacrifice schtick wasn't hard to predict, especially from him, and for a while I was sure that FFXIV was back off its meds, and that his little monologue about wanting to go on adventures with his hero was just to make him Haurchefant 2.0. Godsdammit was that 79 scene too much for my heart.

But the ending, and all the little choices they worked into it, finally communicated to me that they cared. That smile made the past 5 years of waiting worth it, as I had only sometimes let myself hope it would. That is the only kind of use of "Eternal Wind" I will accept. So, at long last, thank you, Yoshida.

I will, however, have to keep calling him "Exarch", as it seems the name G'raha Tia is being held in reserve for someone else after all. I had suspected from his introduction that Exarch could open the Tower on the Source, but not that the story would actually acknowledge that. And yet. I have a feeling that doing so will be what severs the link binding him to our timeline, but that, I think, is the one sacrifice he's allowed to make. (Though it will be bittersweet as hell, especially after our adventure together.)

As for easter eggs relating to the above, you can shoot him during both Dwarf minigames. Also, you can take the Wind-up G'raha to him for a cute little bonus scene.

[Evraeh]

Let's talk about why Hydaelyn was created :
Zodiark, if not Evil, doesn't seem to care about sacrifices.
The Council wanted to sacrifice the new generation to resurrect the previous one, i can only see that has a vicious circle and evil.

Well for Zordiark

I don't feel him so evil as Hydealyn is telling us. Hydealyn said we have to "stop/destroy" ascians (without mercy I guess?), but she never talk about that desaster or maybe she didn't know ? She keeps so much secrets... From what we know, she was summoned to stop Zodiark mighty power (to stop sacrifices). In a strong battle, she wins. Then she protect us/her children, I guess it's normal for a mother. But is that really fair about Zodiark ?

Zodiark saved the planet, it's sure. But after the apocalypse there was not so much left. He needed power to restore a lot - so still need sacrifices. I can understand both camps. One want to save the lost lifes ( who could be trapped in Zodiark ?) and other want to save the current life (sacrificed still to create Hydealyn). It's truly a vicious circle.
I feel Hydaelyn was created to save the "future" without think about the past. But from that point, if Zodiark was created to "save the planet". Do his resurection will mean the end of our world ? Do he is just evil and want to kill everyone ? Or they don't like each other (Zodiark and Hydealyn)?

That is why, I would like to talk directly to Zodiark, cause we have only one version.

[Zackneifein]

Well for Zordiark

I don't feel him so evil as Hydealyn is telling us. Hydealyn said we have to "stop/destroy" ascians (without mercy I guess?), but she never talk about that desaster or maybe she didn't know ? She keeps so much secrets... From what we know, she was summoned to stop Zodiark mighty power (to stop sacrifices). In a strong battle, she wins. Then she protect us/her children, I guess it's normal for a mother. But is that really fair about Zodiark ?

Zodiark saved the planet, it's sure. But after the apocalypse there was not so much left. He needed power to restore a lot - so still need sacrifices. I can understand both camps. One want to save the lost lifes ( who could be trapped in Zodiark ?) and other want to save the current life (sacrificed still to create Hydealyn). It's truly a vicious circle.
I feel Hydaelyn was created to save the "future" without think about the past. But from that point, if Zodiark was created to "save the planet". Do his resurection will mean the end of our world ? Do he is just evil and want to kill everyone ? Or they don't like each other (Zodiark and Hydealyn)?

That is why, I would like to talk directly to Zodiark, cause we have only one version.

Regarding Zordiark

I'm absolutely not against having Zodiark point of view to compare it with Hydaelyn one.
And it's clearly possible that Zodiark is more neutral than evil, and just doing the job he is asked for.

But in fact, we don't have to chose Hydaelyn or Zodiark, what we have to choose is between the choice of the Amaurot Coucil and of the ones who opposed it (that i think are "more or less" still the same then and now with us as their unofficial leader both time). In that matter, my choice is done.
This choice could even conclude that we must end both Hydaelyn and Zodiark.

[Evraeh]

This choice could even conclude that we must end both Hydaelyn and Zodiark.

I think you are right. Not sure how this will finish. A lot more questions remain... Hoping we'll find out soon (and not in 2 years ! Please Square Enix !)

[Fenral]

The Twinning (Level 80 dungeon):

OH. AH. I SEE NOW.

CT, Alexander, and Omega. The Ironworks Trilogy. All to devise a means of sending the Crystal Tower across both time and space. That one was staring us in the face for years and we looked right past it. Welp, hindsight sure is 20/20...


I do feel a little more compassion for the Future People knowing that the Exarch's master plan was something he came up with on his own. They just thought they were reuniting him with the WoL. Stupid cat, always making everything so much messier than it needs to be...

[Zyneste]

Not sure if everyone saw this part, but there is a scene in the crystarium where you can interact with Emet-Selch, confirming that Ascians are tempered.

Your Character: Tell me about Zodiark.
Emet-Selch: As I told you before-Zodiark is the creation of my people. The first people.
Emet-Selch: We summoned Him, as your kind might summon a primal-albeit an infinitely more powerful one.
Emet-Selch: And like one of your primals, He tempered us. It was only natural. There is no resisting such power.
Emet-Selch: And so we Ascians came to exist solely to bring about the rule of darkness. His darkness.
Emet-Selch: Of course, some would call us “evil” for it...and they would be fools. Though that is only to be expected, given their innate inability to conceive of the nature of our universe.
Emet-Selch: ...But I believe I am repeating myself. Do you not trust me to speak honestly? Do you hope to catch me in a lie?
Emet-Selch: Really. I have no need of deception-and even if I did, I assure you: you would find it quite indistinguishable from the truth.
[Dialogue clicked again and your character responded with "...."]
Emet-Selch: <sigh> Will you never grow tired of shuffling your feet?
Emet-Selch: If you have something to ask me, ask.
Emet-Selch: Hmph. Perhaps I flatter myself expecting you to take an interest in the knowledge I possess. Or perhaps I flatter you.