Salted Earth and other questionable changes.

[ShinShimon]

The ridiculous BS you could get up to in AoE situations was the one interesting, distinguishing thing about Dark Knight. Now we just have the edgelord aesthetic.
Probably gonna play through MSQ as DRK and then switch to Gunbreaker.

[Hierro]

This salted earth nerf, to me, screams "lower the skill floor!"

Most people complained about DRK in SB because (I suspect) half the time they couldn't figure out how to put up big numbers like the rest of the tanks. Apparently, the concept of "just press the buttons" is too darn hard. These same people went and posted about DRK being "too clunky" (even though HW DRK was way clunkier yet no one bitched just cause it was part of the DPS meta) or what have you, because they couldn't achieve the same results on DRK than if they had played WAR or PLD with their requiescat buttons for satisfying numbers.

So, what did SE do in turn? They took a look at the oGCDs DRK had to press. They said "oh, people are too dumb to press DA when necessary. Let's just compress the potency into one oGCD, and adjust mana regen so it never overwhelms. There. Now these incompetent players will feel better about themselves. Oh, look, we missed a spot. Yes, let's neuter this "salted earth," so this way it doesn't matter if you press it on CD or not, the impact will be minimal."

I just want every single one of you plebs to realize, this version of DRK we got here was by no means an accident. It is the result of incessant bitching stemming from the fact most of you couldn't cope with DRK's core design being incompatible with your preferred style of gameplay . You just couldn't handle being denied the fantasy of being a great sword badass because it was too hard for you, just too out of your reach, so you had to cry and demand a change. And what do we have now? A job that now resembles WAR. There, you have WAR with a greatsword.

All you crybabies had to do was change jobs to WAR because it's what you clearly wanted instead of ruining a job that was appreciated by the right people for the right reasons.

[gman1311]

This salted earth nerf, to me, screams "lower the skill floor!"

Most people complained about DRK in SB because (I suspect) half the time they couldn't figure out how to put up big numbers like the rest of the tanks. Apparently, the concept of "just press the buttons" is too darn hard. These same people went and posted about DRK being "too clunky" (even though HW DRK was way clunkier yet no one bitched just cause it was part of the DPS meta) or what have you, because they couldn't achieve the same results on DRK than if they had played WAR or PLD with their requiescat buttons for satisfying numbers.

So, what did SE do in turn? They took a look at the oGCDs DRK had to press. They said "oh, people are too dumb to press DA when necessary. Let's just compress the potency into one oGCD, and adjust mana regen so it never overwhelms. There. Now these incompetent players will feel better about themselves. Oh, look, we missed a spot. Yes, let's neuter this "salted earth," so this way it doesn't matter if you press it on CD or not, the impact will be minimal."

I just want every single one of you plebs to realize, this version of DRK we got here was by no means an accident. It is the result of incessant bitching stemming from the fact most of you couldn't cope with DRK's core design being incompatible with your preferred style of gameplay . You just couldn't handle being denied the fantasy of being a great sword badass because it was too hard for you, just too out of your reach, so you had to cry and demand a change. And what do we have now? A job that now resembles WAR. There, you have WAR with a greatsword.

All you crybabies had to do was change jobs to WAR because it's what you clearly wanted instead of ruining a job that was appreciated by the right people for the right reasons.

Most people I know didn’t find Dark Knight hard, we just hated Dark Art spam, and I’m glad it’s gone.

[Danelo]

This salted earth nerf, to me, screams "lower the skill floor!"

Most people complained about DRK in SB because (I suspect) half the time they couldn't figure out how to put up big numbers like the rest of the tanks. Apparently, the concept of "just press the buttons" is too darn hard. These same people went and posted about DRK being "too clunky" (even though HW DRK was way clunkier yet no one bitched just cause it was part of the DPS meta) or what have you, because they couldn't achieve the same results on DRK than if they had played WAR or PLD with their requiescat buttons for satisfying numbers.

So, what did SE do in turn? They took a look at the oGCDs DRK had to press. They said "oh, people are too dumb to press DA when necessary. Let's just compress the potency into one oGCD, and adjust mana regen so it never overwhelms. There. Now these incompetent players will feel better about themselves. Oh, look, we missed a spot. Yes, let's neuter this "salted earth," so this way it doesn't matter if you press it on CD or not, the impact will be minimal."

I just want every single one of you plebs to realize, this version of DRK we got here was by no means an accident. It is the result of incessant bitching stemming from the fact most of you couldn't cope with DRK's core design being incompatible with your preferred style of gameplay . You just couldn't handle being denied the fantasy of being a great sword badass because it was too hard for you, just too out of your reach, so you had to cry and demand a change. And what do we have now? A job that now resembles WAR. There, you have WAR with a greatsword.

All you crybabies had to do was change jobs to WAR because it's what you clearly wanted instead of ruining a job that was appreciated by the right people for the right reasons.

You, as usual, suspect wrong. Except for the aoe, which has now been gutted, SB DRK was a poor design compared to is predecessor.

[Hierro]

You, as usual, suspect wrong. Except for the aoe, which has now been gutted, SB DRK was a poor design compared to is predecessor.

Yeah right. I can guarantee you if DRK was in the DPS meta, no one would complain. HW DRK was super clunky and riddled with design flaws, but everything was forgiven because it was given a fixed slot in speed runs.

Objectively speaking, SB DRK was improved as far as performance and design is concerned.

[Ekimmak]

I can't say that I'm sad to see a lot of the "scales from multiple enemies" aspects of DRK gone.

You had way too low an MP bar for what it felt like to play the mob-rounding game in dungeons.

I never had a problem with Salted Earth uptime, but then, that's because I did research, and added a macro to (a) place Salted Earth on my main target, and (b) added a part to it to tell me when the cooldown is ready. It doesn't take a genius to figure out "If the enemy is an off-arena boss, hit F1 then Salted Macro" instead.

Maybe they should add stuff like *that* to the Hall of the Novice, then the skill ceiling wouldn't need to be pushed down so far we banged our heads on it.

[Danelo]

Yeah right. I can guarantee you if DRK was in the DPS meta, no one would complain. HW DRK was super clunky and riddled with design flaws, but everything was forgiven because it was given a fixed slot in speed runs.

Objectively speaking, SB DRK was improved as far as performance and design is concerned.

I posted this on the next highest DRK thread and it applies:
Dark knight is an awfully designed job because it's built into the middle of a space where PLD has, up until now, covered one end of the spectrum and WAR the other end; low damage/high utility verses high damage/low utility. There's only two catagories there meaning two tanks to be the best at something. You can say all the other themes but those two things are really what it has, in the past, boiled down to. SE needs to realize what everyone that already plays their builds already does know... It's no fun to be in the middle. This is why I was more of a proponent of a main tank / off tank builds. The only alternative is to strip away some of the unique aspects that WAR and PLD have been grandfathered into. Best in class self-sustain, damage, mitigation, utility, OP ultimates (here's looking at you Hg). I'm hoping that SE is realizing that and testing the waters with the lengthening of WAR Hg recast timer, to see how loud the crying gets, as a precursor to those ultimate changes. If they care about the other two tanking jobs they have to do more to widen the gap between the tanks to make them uniquely good at something, which is equally valuable across the board, while being able to compete generally at the rest. Easier said than done, I know, but it's the solution. To do that they will have to strip things away from the extremes on the spectrum (PLD and WAR), or put on their thinking caps as they have previously (3.0).

RANT: SE, for the love of God, get ride of damage specific CDs! You allowed PLD to block magic for a reason! Same logic. It doesn't add flavor to any job. It's a poor mans game flavor. You are better than that... I hope.

The point is that you should hope that DRK gets a good rework because of how much warrior is grandfathered into. It's only a matter of time before SE takes from the rich to give to the poor. And as far WAR goes, you are very rich and ripe to be stolen from, as DRK was in the past.

[Danelo]

Objectively speaking, SB DRK was improved as far as performance and design is concerned.

Throwing "objective" in front of a subjective statement doesn't make it so.

[Hierro]

Throwing "objective" in front of a subjective statement doesn't make it so.

Bruh, I could go on and list a whole plethora of reasons as to why my statement is true. Sadly, that post got deleted in a censored thread when the comparison was made.

[Gemina]

I just want every single one of you plebs to realize, this version of DRK we got here was by no means an accident. It is the result of incessant bitching stemming from the fact most of you couldn't cope with DRK's core design being incompatible with your preferred style of gameplay . You just couldn't handle being denied the fantasy of being a great sword badass because it was too hard for you, just too out of your reach, so you had to cry and demand a change.

All you crybabies had to do was change jobs to WAR because it's what you clearly wanted instead of ruining a job that was appreciated by the right people for the right reasons.

Actually, I just hated spamming dark arts. The other thing I know most griped about was Living Dead, but I never joined in the chorus and it also did not receive any changes or updates. As someone who plays both DRK and NIN, I can tell you that keeping a timer from expiring is far more engaging than spamming and MP drainer over and over and over and over and over and over and.....