An option for characters to start at level 50, pre-heavensward, for FREE

[White_Wolf_X]

[Edax]

As time goes by, I believe that it’s getting harder and harder to get new players into the game. I believe the game’s quality skyrocketed ever since heavensward.

I know lots of people think jump potions should be purchased, but as time goes by I think jump potions shouldn’t be the only option for players to catch up. Starting level 50 from Heavensward makes the most sense to me so we get new characters without disrespecting existing players.
Upvote if you agree

It would be daunting for new players, to suddenly be given a dozen of combat attacks and abilities without even knowing what a combo is or how the basics of combat works. The big problem with getting into HW is the MSQ filler which grinds the leveling process to a complete halt for about a dozen hours for fetch quests that have no rewards.

[PyurBlue]

It would be daunting for new players, to suddenly be given a dozen of combat attacks and abilities without even knowing what a combo is or how the basics of combat works. The big problem with getting into HW is the MSQ filler which grinds the leveling process to a complete halt for about a dozen hours for fetch quests that have no rewards.

Maybe. 50 isn't really that daunting. Black Mage doesn't learn very much between level 1 and 60. It's essentially Fire I all the way. Paladin has one combo and one AoE button. Balancing healing and DPS on healers is a little more challenging, but nothing a tutorial couldn't help with. As it is, I've frequently recommended that new players level in PoTD when they ask for advice on what class to play. Low level doesn't reflect high level play and some new players just don't find the slow pace of skill acquisition interesting.

There might be some need for a level 1 option for players totally unfamiliar with a FF14 style game, but starting at level 50 isn't something that I consider putting novices in too deep.

[galbsadi]

Maybe. 50 isn't really that daunting. Black Mage doesn't learn very much between level 1 and 60. It's essentially Fire I all the way. Paladin has one combo and one AoE button. Balancing healing and DPS on healers is a little more challenging, but nothing a tutorial couldn't help with. As it is, I've frequently recommended that new players level in PoTD when they ask for advice on what class to play. Low level doesn't reflect high level play and some new players just don't find the slow pace of skill acquisition interesting.

There might be some need for a level 1 option for players totally unfamiliar with a FF14 style game, but starting at level 50 isn't something that I consider putting novices in too deep.

To an experienced player, maybe not.

Black Mage at lv50 has a full rotation including shifting away from using Convert in favor of Ice3/Fire3 adjustments by that point, with Flare as a finisher. They also at that point have developed a full set of utility actions (some common to all casters, such as Manashift and Surecast, others specific to them, like Mana Ward).

Paladin at lv50 has their full threat combo, half of their DPS combo, one DPS AoEs, two threat AoEs, several defensive cooldowns (some common to all tanks, such as Anticipation and Rampart, some specific to them, like Bulwark and Sentinel), an offensive cooldown, two stances to apply in different situations, two stuns (one common to all tanks), and a couple of situational abilities.

Note, of course, that you chose to list just two classes as if everything is super-simple to a brand new player, so let's dig deeper:

Dragoons have their basic rotations in play by this point, along with multiple jumps, various utility, etc.

Monks have most of their rotations in play by this point, missing some oGCDs and Riddles.

Ninjas have probably 90% of their lv70 rotations by this point.

Scholars are missing some of their stronger heals (Indom, Excog, etc.), but are largely developed by this point.

Summoners have basically a full rotation at this point, sans trance/Bahamut (which really just build on this rotation anyhow).

Astrologians are pretty well developed at this level.

Bards are well developed at this level.

Dark Knights are well developed at this level.

I'd go as far as to wager that your argument that it's simple at that level largely stems from the fact that either (a) you're forgetting that new players might not be used to the systems this all builds on at this point or (b) you haven't actually leveled every class to this point or higher.

[PyurBlue]

To an experienced player, maybe not.

Those were actually some of the first classes I experienced in the game, so I'm speaking from a new player viewpoint. I am pulling things from memory so I might not be painting a completely accurate picture but I don't feel like my opinions are completely unfounded here.

I think you also misinterpreted my post to mean that any player would be able to jump into the game at 50. That's not the case.

Black Mage at lv50 has a full rotation including shifting away from using Convert in favor of Ice3/Fire3 adjustments by that point, with Flare as a finisher. They also at that point have developed a full set of utility actions (some common to all casters, such as Manashift and Surecast, others specific to them, like Mana Ward).

There are more skill available than Fire 1 for sure, but most of those are pretty situational. For the most part you're pressing F1 over and over. When I was leveling it I had to consider if the class was what I really wanted to play until I was able to experience level 60. It took that long for managing the class and its resources to actually become interesting. Starting immediately at level 50 would present learning a curve compared to level 1, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I guess it depends on if you just want to pick up the class in full right away or want some complexity to play with.

Paladin at lv50 has their full threat combo, half of their DPS combo, one DPS AoEs, two threat AoEs, several defensive cooldowns (some common to all tanks, such as Anticipation and Rampart, some specific to them, like Bulwark and Sentinel), an offensive cooldown, two stances to apply in different situations, two stuns (one common to all tanks), and a couple of situational abilities.

The half DPS combo is useless because the aggro combo out DPS's it. All you can really do with Riot blade is build MP for flash. This didn't take me very long to figure out as a first time tank. Defensive cooldowns are pretty straight forward and I distinctly remember being super cautious when the only one I had was Rampart because with just 1 CD you can only maintain so much defensive uptime. If I had more options I might have been encouraged to use CD's more often as you're supposed to.

other classes

While some of these are harder to learn than other classes (I'd say Monk and Ninja specifically), FF14's leveling system isn't actually very good at teaching classes either. There are points where you need to unlearn habits that you've picked up previously. You mentioned one with Black Mage actually. Using the III spells to swap element instead of transpose. You don't even unlock both of the spells at the same time. Being giving a bunch of skills at once has its own challenges, but also provides advantages in that the skillset that you're learning is going to change less often.

I'd go as far as to wager that your argument that it's simple at that level largely stems from the fact that either (a) you're forgetting that new players might not be used to the systems this all builds on at this point or (b) you haven't actually leveled every class to this point or higher.

What I was specifically saying was that starting from 50 isn't necessarily beyond the ability of a new player (but it's not realistic for all new players) to cope with. I pointed out a couple of simple classes to support that and I also based my idea on my own new player experience and discussions with new players that I've encountered in the game.

Whether or not it's simple would depend on what you consider simple. You can't pick up level 50 classes blind and jump into content, but you can get familiar with them pretty quickly with practice. That's not a negative for all new players and overbearing simplicity like the first 15 levels isn't a positive for all new players either.

[MariaArvana]

It would be daunting for new players, to suddenly be given a dozen of combat attacks and abilities without even knowing what a combo is or how the basics of combat works. The big problem with getting into HW is the MSQ filler which grinds the leveling process to a complete halt for about a dozen hours for fetch quests that have no rewards.

Especially for new players to the genre(which there are a lot, considering the FF single player fan draw) ARR is necessary as a teaching tool, so no. I really don't want to subject some brand new, only played FFXV, bright eyed newbie to the Sohm Al bosses just because they think using a sword and shield makes them look like Gladio. And that's just the second dungeon of HW...

ARR is a pretty bad teaching tool besides introducing the player on how to talk to NPCs. Whether you start them at level 1 or level 70, people who want to learn will, and those who don't won't. Take a look at the still large amount of players at level 70 who refuse/don't/etc use AoE when 10+ mobs are pulled, do whacky rotations, don't maintain/use their full toolkits/buffs, don't even read some of their tooltips, etc. Saying they should go through ARR to be taught is pointless when starting them at 50/60/70 with some extremely powerful tutorials (Like a mandatory hall of the intermediate) can accomplish the same thing in 1/100th of the time with 10000% more effectiveness.

I think part of the problem here is people coming in with other MMOs in mind, thinking current endgame is the only thing that matters.

This game is more like a traditional rpg. The entire journey matters.

You wouldn't buy final fantasy 7 and request to only play the last disk, skipping everything else, would you?

Believe it or not, FF14 is still an MMO first and foremost by a VERY large margint. Lots of people like to join to play with their friends and don't care much for the story when there's big, epic bosses to kill with said friends. Half of my friend group has been around since 2.0 and none of those people could tell you the name of half of the scions or major characters in the story due to how little they pay attention. Scaring off potential new long standing, long paying players with a gigantic, forced storyline will only hurt FF14 in the long run as old players leave and new ones aren't staying to replace them. That being said, Jump potions are a good compromise anyway, though I feel their price could do with being cut a bit or a free one being given away for buying a special version of the game.

[Edax]

ARR is a pretty bad teaching tool besides introducing the player on how to talk to NPCs. Whether you start them at level 1 or level 70, people who want to learn will, and those who don't won't. Take a look at the still large amount of dps players at level 70 who refuse/don't/etc use AoE when 10+ mobs are pulled, do whacky rotations, don't maintain/use their full toolkits/buffs, don't even read some of their tooltips, etc. Saying they should go through ARR to be taught is pointless when starting them at 50/60/70 with some extremely powerful tutorials (Like a mandatory hall of the intermediate) can accomplish the same thing in 1/100th of the time with 10000% more effectiveness.

Just because some players can't learn from experience doesn't mean most players don't. I personally have not seen that many dps players not use AOE attacks when 10+ mobs are pulled. For me personally, learning how to Dragoon was far easier for me because I started as a Lancer from scratch then when I became a Samurai suddenly at level 50. It took me 2 days with a house dummy to figure out how to arrange the Samurai abilities onto my hotkeys to get the rotations to even work, more days still to commit them to muscle memory. AAR introduces abilities one at a time, which is far better then introducing abilities a dozen at a time.

[Kaethra]

Believe it or not, FF14 is still an MMO first and foremost by a VERY large margint. Lots of people like to join to play with their friends and don't care much for the story when there's big, epic bosses to kill with said friends. Half of my friend group has been around since 2.0 and none of those people could tell you the name of half of the scions or major characters in the story due to how little they pay attention.

My group of friends does this as well. Currently have one playing catch up through Stormblood and they're skipping the cutscenes. I give them a brief gist of what's going on as they complete sections. But truth be told, if we had the option to go straight to dungeons. We would.

I'm not particularly fond of granting levels. I don't mind some sort of uber tutorial that offers a way to speed things along like my suggestion on page 2. Something akin to 5 duties covering the major points and each one gives 10 levels or whatnot. But truthfully I think it should be an option at the very least to opt out of the story entirely. If someone wishes to level 1-70 in dungeons and have access to any dungeon their level or ilvl lets them have access to without needing the plot, story, or interaction, they should be allowed to do so.

There is a ton of Dungeon content in this game. Far more than most MMORPGs. The MSQ for those of us who wish to skip it, is really a minor distraction. In less than two days you can go complete Stormblood in this manner. Why not simply give us back those two days to get some tomestones? Let friends who get started behind their group jump right in with the rest. Its hurts no one else. It doesn't cheapen the story for anyone who wants to experience it. It doesn't take away from how they wish to play.

Everyone ought to be able to play FFXIV the way they wish to play it. I'm personally not even looking for an easier way to get to max level. As everyone knows, the MSQ is one of the most efficient ways to level as a solo player. I just wish we had more options.

[Melichoir]

As time goes by, I believe that it’s getting harder and harder to get new players into the game. I believe the game’s quality skyrocketed ever since heavensward.

I know lots of people think jump potions should be purchased, but as time goes by I think jump potions shouldn’t be the only option for players to catch up. Starting level 50 from Heavensward makes the most sense to me so we get new characters without disrespecting existing players.
Upvote if you agree

Much like other threads of hte same calibur, No, you shouldnt get jump potions. New Players should play ARR. However, streamlining some parts isnt a bad idea, particularly in 2.1-2.55. Best solution Ive had was to take some of the MSQ quests out of the MSQ and list them as content side quests. Theyre still in the game, you can experience them if you want to, but now their side material so you can expedite some of the leveling involved.

[Endeleon]

Especially for new players to the genre(which there are a lot, considering the FF single player fan draw) ARR is necessary as a teaching tool, so no. I really don't want to subject some brand new, only played FFXV, bright eyed newbie to the Sohm Al bosses just because they think using a sword and shield makes them look like Gladio. And that's just the second dungeon of HW...