True North and Positionals

[SoulEchelon]

Positionals should be scrapped honestly they're boring.

So standing completely still is less boring?

[Burningskull]

First and foremost I don't have a problem doing positionals. I just see them as pointless and punishment from the fight design. The mechanics of the fight already have players moving as is so I don't see how moving once per rotation adds anything. Also all I'm hearing on the defense of positionals is, "I want a reason to say I'm better than someone else." Doing positonals doesn't change how a boss reacts to you. Doesn't change what moves the boss uses. They don't even change what buttons you press in what order. I'm sorry, I don't see the point of them. Yes I will continue to use them as I play all the DPS jobs. However I think this is an archaic system that should be scraped.

[Inosaska]

So standing completely still is less boring?

Umm you realize that he is playing a tank right?

[Dzian]

First and foremost I don't have a problem doing positionals. I just see them as pointless and punishment from the fight design. The mechanics of the fight already have players moving as is so I don't see how moving once per rotation adds anything. Also all I'm hearing on the defense of positionals is, "I want a reason to say I'm better than someone else." Doing positonals doesn't change how a boss reacts to you. Doesn't change what moves the boss uses. They don't even change what buttons you press in what order. I'm sorry, I don't see the point of them. Yes I will continue to use them as I play all the DPS jobs. However I think this is an archaic system that should be scraped.

QFT!

If positionals did ANYTHING interesting I'd have no issue with them at all. attack from the rear break a bosses tail..attack from the flank break his claw or something that actually then went and changed the fight somehow. that would be fun engaging and interesting.

half a step left for 15 extra potency once per rotation... dull boring and utterly pointless

[JohnSpawnVFX]

QFT!

If positionals did ANYTHING interesting I'd have no issue with them at all. attack from the rear break a bosses tail..attack from the flank break his claw or something that actually then went and changed the fight somehow. that would be fun engaging and interesting.

half a step left for 15 extra potency once per rotation... dull boring and utterly pointless

In this case, removing something "dull boring and utterly pointless" is just going to make things even more dull boring and utterly pointless.

And let's not pretend this isn't just a pretext because people who don't like doing positionals don't like being reminded of what they miss out by not doing them.

[Duskane]

I think positionals add alot to some jobs
And do feel good on occasion

Trick attack as example nice getting it off feels bad when boss turns around

Monk entire purpose of its speed and flow to it so moving around the boss fits well

"Wheeling thrust" and "fang and claw" is enjoyable to me pretty much similar feeling with Monk

Samurai probably one where potionals feel meh and feels like after thought with the class to me

[SerLuke]

QFT!

If positionals did ANYTHING interesting I'd have no issue with them at all. attack from the rear break a bosses tail..attack from the flank break his claw or something that actually then went and changed the fight somehow. that would be fun engaging and interesting.

half a step left for 15 extra potency once per rotation... dull boring and utterly pointless

Dude I freaking love fights like that, like Shinyru ex or Rahtlos I wish we had more, def more fun than positionals. I always love that kinda thing in other JRPGs too

[Dzian]

people who don't like doing positionals don't like being reminded of what they miss out by not doing them.

What do you really miss out on though?
It really isn't that much in some cases..

Posutionals make the difference between good and great DPS players. No need to lower the already low skill ceiling.

They really don't make a difference though.. at least not noticeably so..

In the case of ninja. A player who just stands behind a boss and stays there completely ignoring positionals and only ever moves for mechanics.... What is he really going to lose?
60 potency bonus on an Armor Crush once every 30 seconds... That's effectively a whopping loss of TWO potency per second. 2!!!!
That really isn't going to do anything to distinguish a good player from a great player.

Samurai is perhaps a bit more tricky. A player who basically stays in one position the entire fight won't lose any potency but will lose roughly 10 kenki every 8 gcds.
If you then say a gcd is 2 seconds and 10 kenki is 40% of a 300 potency Shinten. then that's around 120 potency lost over 16 seconds which is what? A loss of roughly 7 PPS.

Admittedly I'm not entirely sure what that works out to as a percentage of a jobs total PPS, but I'm pretty sure its less than 2% which again isn't going to do anything to separate good players from great players.

Dude I freaking love fights like that, like Shinyru ex or Rahtlos I wish we had more, def more fun than positionals. I always love that kinda thing in other JRPGs too

Yeah same.

[Ogulbuk]

So standing completely still is less boring?

I can see both sides of the argument. I find positional give some jobs flavor but feel they are overused in melee DPS.

However, as far as thing becoming “boring” without positional, boss encounters could be redesigned to be even more intensive on avoidance at melee range. Right now, positional requirements kinda shackle developers ability to use live-or-die avoidance requirements. It can be fine, but if it’s done too often melee DPS end up underperforming.

[Krojack]

It's possible to have abilities on another action bar which can be toggled on a whim. Button space is pretty manageable even now.

Not really. You're forgetting about controller players on console.. As the game keeps growing and new abilities are added, button space starts becoming more and more limited for controller players.